Jack O'Lanterns

[00:00:00] Astonishing Legends Network

[00:00:04] Disclaimer, this episode includes the usual amount of adult language and graphic discussions you've come to expect around here.

[00:00:10] But in the event it becomes an unusual amount, expect another call from me.

[00:00:15] Welcome back to Scared All The Time. I'm Chris Collari.

[00:00:18] And I'm Ed Vecola.

[00:00:19] And this week, this All Hallows Eve, the best day of days, we're going to celebrate by carving a path through the bizarre history of jack-o'-lanterns.

[00:00:28] And that's not all we've got lined up, all a-flickering and glowing on the Scared All The Time front porch this evening.

[00:00:35] In addition to the wild myths and legends that grew into what we know as the modern-day jack-o'-lantern,

[00:00:41] we've lined up an entire patch of pumpkin-based crimes to talk about.

[00:00:46] Plus, if you trick-or-treat with us tonight, we're going to drop the story of some of the strangest, grossest candy ever produced into your pillowcase.

[00:00:53] So crack your candy and get ready to get scared, because it turns out the history and mystery of Halloween pumpkins is as strange as anything we've ever covered.

[00:01:03] What are we?

[00:01:04] Scared.

[00:01:05] When are we?

[00:01:06] All the time.

[00:01:07] Join us.

[00:01:08] Join us.

[00:01:09] Join us.

[00:01:10] Now it is time for...

[00:01:11] Time for...

[00:01:12] Scared All The Time.

[00:01:15] Hey, everybody.

[00:01:16] Welcome back.

[00:01:17] A special welcome, special shout-out to anyone who just discovered us listening to Sinisterhood or The Y Files.

[00:01:24] We're happy to have you hanging out here with the rest of the Scaredy Cats.

[00:01:27] If you like what you hear, you want to get access to some bonus material, some livestream shows that we do, and exclusive merch,

[00:01:33] head on over to patreon.com backslash scaredallthetime to sign up for Scared All The Time Premium, where it's always a good time.

[00:01:40] And speaking of which, we'll be announcing a date for our live show this month in a few days, so keep an eye out for that.

[00:01:46] Those shows have been crazy fun, and I've got a lot of updates and articles that I can't wait to share with you guys this month.

[00:01:54] So eyes open, you'll get an email, we'll post everywhere.

[00:01:57] You'll know it's coming.

[00:01:58] The question will be, will you join us?

[00:02:01] Yeah, it'll probably.

[00:02:02] I mean, if you're with us in real time, then you know this week is insane.

[00:02:04] Like, we're dropping a ton of shit, we're filling up your goodie bags, we want this to be a really fun anniversary in Halloween,

[00:02:09] so the live show might very well just be, like, keeping that week going.

[00:02:13] Yeah, it'll probably be next week, because for now, we are in the death throes of October,

[00:02:17] which is the month that we premiered this show almost exactly one year ago on October 19th, 2023,

[00:02:26] the day before I got married.

[00:02:28] So I was just having anniversary after anniversary a few weeks ago.

[00:02:32] And Ed, in the meantime, has been putting the finishing touches on a whole bunch of special episodes that,

[00:02:38] if you didn't see the posts about them yesterday, oh baby, are you going to see them today?

[00:02:43] You're going to hear about it right now.

[00:02:45] We dropped our crossover episode with Midnight Library yesterday,

[00:02:49] and we're dropping this episode, your weekly episode for you today,

[00:02:53] and then we are dropping three anniversary episodes over the next three days for free,

[00:02:59] because we love you guys for sticking with us for this long.

[00:03:03] So enjoy your goodie bag, enjoy the candy.

[00:03:06] It's going to be a very happy Halloween on Scaredy Cat Street,

[00:03:10] and we can't wait to see what you guys think of what we've got lined up for you.

[00:03:15] Before we get into five-star reviews,

[00:03:17] I also just wanted to mention that I know we deviated from our October schedule that we announced.

[00:03:22] Yeah, but luckily we only posted that pretty deep into the weirdest parts of the web.

[00:03:26] I couldn't even find it to fix it, so it's fine.

[00:03:30] No one saw that schedule, don't worry.

[00:03:32] Well, listen, I just want to say,

[00:03:34] I feel like we brought up the Snuff Films episode,

[00:03:36] that it's coming, that it's going to be on the calendar,

[00:03:38] and it was on the calendar,

[00:03:39] and we had some people say they were excited for the Snuff Films episode,

[00:03:43] so I just want to say it is still coming.

[00:03:46] It's going to be worth it.

[00:03:47] It turns out I actually know a guy

[00:03:49] who has been researching the world of Snuff Films for years

[00:03:53] for a documentary that he's been working on,

[00:03:56] and so he's not only helping to put the episode together,

[00:03:59] he's going to come guest on it as well.

[00:04:01] So he sent me some of the information already,

[00:04:05] and oh boy, oh boy,

[00:04:07] it's stuff that you're not going to find on the internet, folks.

[00:04:10] So it's going to be a really interesting episode.

[00:04:12] It'll likely be our last episode,

[00:04:14] so it was nice doing the show while it lasted.

[00:04:17] Yeah, it's an under-researched topic in the sense that it is...

[00:04:21] Impossible to research.

[00:04:22] It's truly impossible to research,

[00:04:23] but it's also just like an urban legend

[00:04:25] that is one of those tantalizingly,

[00:04:29] you know, it's everybody has heard from a friend of a friend

[00:04:33] that one of these things exists on the internet somewhere,

[00:04:36] or, you know, back in the day on tapes,

[00:04:39] and I don't know, it's a really crazy legend

[00:04:42] that I think is very genuinely scary.

[00:04:44] It's worth doing an episode about.

[00:04:46] It's pretty fun.

[00:04:47] It's not fun.

[00:04:48] You know what I'm saying.

[00:04:49] Well, it's not fun.

[00:04:51] You know what we mean.

[00:04:51] You know what is fun?

[00:04:52] Halloween, and this is a Halloween episode.

[00:04:55] Yes, it is.

[00:04:55] And before we get into the fun of Halloween,

[00:04:58] we're going to do some five-star reviews.

[00:05:01] You know Five Star Review Corner.

[00:05:02] You write us a good five-star review.

[00:05:05] We're going to read it.

[00:05:06] Well, we might read it on the show.

[00:05:07] And if you find a way to sneak scared all the time

[00:05:10] into that five-star review

[00:05:12] that's not just saying the name of the show,

[00:05:14] then we will put that review to the top of the list.

[00:05:17] So the first review we're going to do today

[00:05:18] is titled New Found Boogeyman,

[00:05:21] five-star review from Fatboy Lucha.

[00:05:24] And he says,

[00:05:43] Yeah, we do.

[00:05:46] When you read this,

[00:05:48] go back and read the first word

[00:05:49] from every odd sentence for my sneaky plug.

[00:05:51] Time was due to write the five-star review

[00:05:54] for Five Star Corner.

[00:05:55] And sure enough,

[00:05:56] if you go back and read the first word

[00:05:58] from every odd sentence,

[00:06:00] it says,

[00:06:01] I am the Zodiac Killer.

[00:06:05] Does it really?

[00:06:05] No.

[00:06:06] I didn't hear any of those words in this review.

[00:06:08] No, it says,

[00:06:09] Scared all the time.

[00:06:11] So thank you,

[00:06:12] Fatboy Lucha,

[00:06:13] for leaving a five-star review

[00:06:15] and sneaking Scared all the time into it.

[00:06:18] Great job.

[00:06:19] We love you.

[00:06:20] Thanks for leaving the review.

[00:06:21] Ed, what is your five-star review?

[00:06:24] I have a five-star review here

[00:06:25] from the original AL Hat Man.

[00:06:28] So I don't know how old this username is

[00:06:30] from a couple weeks ago.

[00:06:32] And it says,

[00:06:34] The subject is,

[00:06:35] From casually interested to fully intrigued.

[00:06:37] And the body of this review says,

[00:06:39] Great show.

[00:06:40] Chris brings the energy

[00:06:41] of a hyperactive 12-year-old voracious reader,

[00:06:45] while Ed's energy is that of Chris's drunk uncle,

[00:06:48] who's either too intoxicated to stand up and leave,

[00:06:51] or just has nowhere else better to be.

[00:06:53] Okay?

[00:06:54] Sounds weird, but it works.

[00:06:56] Their genuine friendship

[00:06:57] and combined wit

[00:06:58] makes listening to a couple of moderately educated dudes

[00:07:02] talk about flesh-hitting bacteria

[00:07:04] for an hour and a half

[00:07:05] an enjoyable experience.

[00:07:07] Thanks to Chris and Ed

[00:07:08] for making my Thursdays a bit better.

[00:07:11] Well, I'm glad it was at least a bit.

[00:07:12] And it's signed the original

[00:07:14] Astonishing Legends Hat Man.

[00:07:16] And then in parentheses,

[00:07:17] it says,

[00:07:18] Go listen to the last two minutes

[00:07:19] of Astonishing Legends

[00:07:20] John Teeter

[00:07:21] and other time travelers episode

[00:07:23] for context.

[00:07:24] And he finishes it with,

[00:07:25] This is a joke for no one.

[00:07:26] Close parentheses.

[00:07:27] And if you've listened to our show,

[00:07:28] then you know that we love jokes for no one.

[00:07:30] We make them all the time.

[00:07:30] So thanks so much for the review

[00:07:32] and can't wait to go listen to the first,

[00:07:35] the last two minutes.

[00:07:36] We'll listen to at least the last two minutes

[00:07:38] of that episode.

[00:07:38] We'll give it a shot.

[00:07:39] Perfect.

[00:07:40] And I will,

[00:07:41] I'll just add in there

[00:07:42] that the secret to the show

[00:07:44] is that secretly,

[00:07:46] Ed and I are both the drunk uncle.

[00:07:48] I am,

[00:07:49] I do have the energy of a voracious reader,

[00:07:51] but we like to have fun

[00:07:53] while we're recording.

[00:07:54] So true.

[00:07:55] And then did we have one more?

[00:07:56] We usually do three.

[00:07:57] All right.

[00:07:58] This five star review comes to us

[00:08:00] from Ichi8564

[00:08:03] titled Fantastically Gross.

[00:08:05] As a longtime listener of Astonishing Legends,

[00:08:08] I was stoked to hear about this podcast.

[00:08:09] I started listening from day one

[00:08:11] and I wait with bated breath

[00:08:12] for each new episode.

[00:08:13] I've never been one to think

[00:08:15] or worry about the heinous,

[00:08:16] scary stuff in life,

[00:08:17] but this episode has changed my life

[00:08:18] for the good and the bad.

[00:08:20] I'm grossed out and laughing at the same time.

[00:08:23] I love every episode

[00:08:24] and look forward to every future episode.

[00:08:25] My sister didn't really listen to podcasts

[00:08:27] and she absolutely loves you guys

[00:08:29] after I introduced her.

[00:08:31] You make learning gross and fun.

[00:08:32] So thanks for that.

[00:08:34] You're welcome.

[00:08:35] All right.

[00:08:35] That's what we're here for, man.

[00:08:36] I wonder what episode that was.

[00:08:38] It's gotta be flesh eating bacteria, right?

[00:08:40] Yeah.

[00:08:40] Mid-October.

[00:08:41] So yeah, probably.

[00:08:42] Yeah.

[00:08:42] We got a lot of five star reviews

[00:08:44] right around the time

[00:08:45] of flesh eating bacteria.

[00:08:46] That episode is one my buddy,

[00:08:48] Ellie,

[00:08:48] shout out Ellie,

[00:08:49] still can't listen to flesh eating bacteria

[00:08:51] because it's his greatest fear.

[00:08:53] So now we know why.

[00:08:54] Now we know why.

[00:08:55] Yeah.

[00:08:55] As we always say,

[00:08:57] if we do the show right,

[00:08:58] there will be one episode

[00:08:59] that every person can't listen to.

[00:09:01] That's true.

[00:09:01] It'll be different for everyone,

[00:09:02] but there'll be one that they go,

[00:09:04] no thanks.

[00:09:05] And you know what?

[00:09:06] Don't feel bad.

[00:09:07] That's fine.

[00:09:08] Because there's a lot of podcasts out there

[00:09:09] where you just say no thanks

[00:09:10] to the whole podcast.

[00:09:11] So we'll take it

[00:09:12] if it's just one episode.

[00:09:13] And before we head into the episode,

[00:09:15] I just wanted to say a few more things.

[00:09:16] One,

[00:09:17] for the international button of the month people

[00:09:19] in Scare All Time Premium,

[00:09:21] we're doing quarterly shipments,

[00:09:22] we've decided.

[00:09:23] So a bunch of you are ready for your buttons.

[00:09:25] So I'll be reaching out to you guys

[00:09:26] in the next week or two

[00:09:27] to solidify the proper way

[00:09:29] to format international addresses and stuff.

[00:09:32] So anyone who's been waiting on those,

[00:09:33] it's happening.

[00:09:34] It's fucking happening finally.

[00:09:35] And lastly,

[00:09:37] speaking of jack-o'-lanterns,

[00:09:38] the topic of today's episode,

[00:09:40] Chris,

[00:09:40] are you going to be carving any yourself this year?

[00:09:42] Or did you carve any?

[00:09:44] My wife and I are carving some pumpkins today, actually.

[00:09:47] It's going to be totally traditional style,

[00:09:49] two triangle eyes,

[00:09:51] a couple triangle mouths,

[00:09:52] nothing fancy.

[00:09:53] I have no artistic skill in that realm.

[00:09:56] So are you?

[00:09:58] Are you carving anything?

[00:09:59] I'm going to carve pumpkins tomorrow

[00:10:01] when everything's on sale.

[00:10:03] And I can get some cheap-ass pumpkins

[00:10:05] because I might try some of those

[00:10:06] kind of wild, hard-to-do shading ones.

[00:10:09] And so if I have a couple of duds,

[00:10:11] I'm fine with it.

[00:10:12] But speaking of wild, hard-to-do pumpkins,

[00:10:15] send us in your pumpkins.

[00:10:16] If anyone carve some cool shit,

[00:10:18] send it over.

[00:10:19] We'd love to see it.

[00:10:19] Yeah, we'll do Instagram stories.

[00:10:21] Send us email or whatever

[00:10:23] and we'll put a bunch up on Instagram.

[00:10:25] Yeah, email us or add us somewhere

[00:10:26] and we'll definitely post your...

[00:10:28] We'd love to see everyone's pumpkin decorations.

[00:10:30] That'd be awesome.

[00:10:32] Happy Halloween, everybody.

[00:10:33] I hope you have a great

[00:10:35] High Holy Halloween

[00:10:36] and we will see you in the episode.

[00:10:40] So I guess right off the bat, Ed,

[00:10:43] first big question to answer,

[00:10:45] are we afraid of jack-o'-lanterns?

[00:10:47] No.

[00:10:47] No, not really.

[00:10:49] Not in a I'm going to cross the street

[00:10:50] to avoid one way.

[00:10:52] No, I think unless it's a top-aheadless horseman,

[00:10:54] I don't think it's a problem.

[00:10:56] No, I would...

[00:10:57] If I see a jack-o'-lantern,

[00:10:59] I actually will probably cross the street

[00:11:01] to see it more closely

[00:11:03] because where there is a grinning pumpkin,

[00:11:05] there is probably going to be

[00:11:06] some Halloween mischief not far behind.

[00:11:09] And as you know,

[00:11:10] if you listened to this show last year

[00:11:12] when we were just getting started,

[00:11:13] it's Halloween,

[00:11:14] which means I'm back home

[00:11:16] at the same place I am every Halloween

[00:11:18] in Hershey, Pennsylvania.

[00:11:20] Hershey is not just the chocolate capital of the world.

[00:11:23] It's one of the best places on earth

[00:11:24] to go trick-or-treating.

[00:11:26] And honestly,

[00:11:27] I don't even think it's really

[00:11:27] because of the candy factory.

[00:11:28] They never did anything special for Halloween.

[00:11:31] It's more just suburban and cute.

[00:11:34] And while not every street goes all out,

[00:11:36] there are a few streets

[00:11:37] near the center of town

[00:11:38] where my mom lives

[00:11:39] that are incredible.

[00:11:41] They have home haunts,

[00:11:43] giant homemade monster displays,

[00:11:45] and hundreds of carved pumpkins

[00:11:47] set out to crank the Halloween mood

[00:11:50] to 11.

[00:11:51] Last year,

[00:11:51] there was even a silent Michael Myers guy,

[00:11:54] like a guy dressed as Michael Myers,

[00:11:56] and like the new Halloween Michael Myers.

[00:11:58] Okay.

[00:11:59] Like new version mask,

[00:12:01] stalking around,

[00:12:02] and he honestly maybe went a little too hard

[00:12:05] because I took some pictures of him,

[00:12:07] and as I was taking them,

[00:12:09] I had a real,

[00:12:11] this could be the real Michael

[00:12:12] and no one would know moment.

[00:12:14] Well, yeah.

[00:12:14] I mean,

[00:12:15] how many schlock movies

[00:12:16] have you seen

[00:12:17] where so often

[00:12:19] there's a costume party?

[00:12:21] Yeah.

[00:12:21] Like it's either at a school

[00:12:22] or at their place of work,

[00:12:24] at a dance,

[00:12:25] just something

[00:12:26] where we can put the killer in a mask

[00:12:28] that like we don't know

[00:12:29] who the killer is at this party.

[00:12:30] Yeah.

[00:12:31] And yeah,

[00:12:31] no one's expecting,

[00:12:33] it's like a terrible witness account.

[00:12:35] Yes.

[00:12:35] He's like,

[00:12:36] oh,

[00:12:36] fucking a pirate stabbed her?

[00:12:38] There's 30 pirates here.

[00:12:39] Yeah.

[00:12:40] Well,

[00:12:40] this guy was really,

[00:12:41] I mean,

[00:12:42] he was doing nothing,

[00:12:43] which is also the best way

[00:12:45] to be Michael Myers,

[00:12:46] which just walk

[00:12:47] and don't talk

[00:12:48] and don't let anyone

[00:12:49] get too close to you.

[00:12:50] And he didn't have a kid or anything.

[00:12:52] He wasn't accompanying anyone.

[00:12:53] He would just like stand on a corner

[00:12:55] for a while

[00:12:56] and watch people

[00:12:57] and then he would move.

[00:12:58] I kind of feel like

[00:12:59] that's tough, right?

[00:13:01] Because it's Halloween

[00:13:01] and you want everyone

[00:13:02] to have a good time

[00:13:03] and, you know,

[00:13:04] let their freak flag fly

[00:13:05] on the one day a year.

[00:13:07] You really can.

[00:13:08] But at the same time,

[00:13:09] I'm also like

[00:13:09] I'm calling the police.

[00:13:10] Yeah.

[00:13:11] I don't want to be like

[00:13:11] a Karen about this,

[00:13:13] but you don't have a kid here.

[00:13:15] I don't know who you are.

[00:13:16] You won't talk.

[00:13:18] You're being fucking weird.

[00:13:19] Yeah.

[00:13:19] And I know this is the night

[00:13:21] to do it

[00:13:21] and you're cosplaying

[00:13:22] as a silent weirdo,

[00:13:23] but fucking move it on

[00:13:25] down the road.

[00:13:26] Yeah.

[00:13:26] You gotta adjust.

[00:13:27] One of my favorite things

[00:13:28] about going home

[00:13:29] is that the street

[00:13:30] near where my mom lives

[00:13:31] gets a good amount

[00:13:32] of trick-or-treaters

[00:13:33] and so one of my favorite things

[00:13:35] is waiting by the door

[00:13:37] with a bowl of candy

[00:13:38] and actually doing

[00:13:39] the handing out

[00:13:40] of the candy to kids

[00:13:42] and I make sure

[00:13:43] that depending on

[00:13:44] what kid I find

[00:13:46] when I open the door,

[00:13:47] I kind of adjust

[00:13:48] my level of spookiness

[00:13:49] for the kids

[00:13:50] so if I open the door

[00:13:51] and it's like young kids,

[00:13:53] I just do happy Halloween

[00:13:55] and if they're older kids,

[00:13:57] I'll try to find

[00:13:57] something weird to say

[00:13:59] or you know.

[00:14:00] And if they're over 18,

[00:14:01] I'm just gonna pull out a gun.

[00:14:02] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:14:04] And shoot them dead.

[00:14:05] Out of the bowl of candy

[00:14:06] comes like a nine millimeter.

[00:14:08] Trick-or-treat motherfuckers.

[00:14:09] And I'll be like,

[00:14:10] what are you doing here?

[00:14:10] You're 31 years old.

[00:14:12] Anyway, point is,

[00:14:13] there's no better way

[00:14:14] to celebrate Halloween

[00:14:15] on this podcast

[00:14:16] than to take a tour

[00:14:17] through the ancient

[00:14:18] twisted history

[00:14:18] of the seemingly harmless

[00:14:20] jack-o'-lantern.

[00:14:21] There's something about

[00:14:22] that grinning face

[00:14:23] carved out of a pumpkin

[00:14:24] that is just,

[00:14:25] I don't know,

[00:14:26] they can be eerie.

[00:14:27] I think maybe it's something

[00:14:29] about giving kids knives

[00:14:30] and helping them carve

[00:14:32] the slimy guts

[00:14:33] of a pumpkin out of it

[00:14:34] and then giving it

[00:14:35] a new face

[00:14:36] and putting it on display.

[00:14:37] There's something very

[00:14:39] primal and tribal about.

[00:14:40] And while jack-o'-lanterns

[00:14:41] aren't really particularly

[00:14:42] scary in real life,

[00:14:44] they have become

[00:14:45] a sinister symbol

[00:14:46] that's been repurposed

[00:14:47] in pop culture

[00:14:48] as a catch-all

[00:14:49] for Halloween nightmares.

[00:14:51] There's the opening shot

[00:14:52] of John Carpenter's Halloween

[00:14:53] that's just a slow track in

[00:14:55] on a flickering pumpkin.

[00:14:56] There's a sequence

[00:14:57] in my other favorite

[00:14:58] Halloween movie,

[00:14:59] Trick-or-Treat,

[00:15:00] that revolves around

[00:15:01] pumpkin carving.

[00:15:02] I remember there was

[00:15:03] a Goosebumps book

[00:15:04] called Attack of the Jack-O'-Lanterns,

[00:15:07] though I don't really

[00:15:07] remember anything about it.

[00:15:09] It's like Killer Tomatoes, but...

[00:15:10] Yeah.

[00:15:11] ...more festive.

[00:15:11] Ed, you might know

[00:15:12] more about this one.

[00:15:14] Obviously, there's Green Goblin

[00:15:15] and his pumpkin bombs.

[00:15:17] Yeah, which I have one here,

[00:15:18] two actually,

[00:15:18] from my time working

[00:15:19] in Hollywood.

[00:15:20] That's awesome.

[00:15:21] Well, this is what

[00:15:22] I really want to know

[00:15:23] if you know.

[00:15:24] There's a whole other

[00:15:24] Spider-Man villain...

[00:15:26] Hobgoblin.

[00:15:26] Well, there's one named

[00:15:27] Jack-O'-Lantern, right?

[00:15:29] Well, there's the new...

[00:15:30] Hobgoblin's got more

[00:15:31] of a Jack-O'-Lantern vibe,

[00:15:32] but that's a Steve question.

[00:15:34] Okay.

[00:15:34] I mean, if it is,

[00:15:35] it's like a fucking

[00:15:35] not important one.

[00:15:37] Oh, okay.

[00:15:37] All right.

[00:15:38] For some reason,

[00:15:38] I feel like when I was a kid,

[00:15:40] my friend had like

[00:15:41] Spider-Man trading cards,

[00:15:43] and this is when I was

[00:15:44] like five years old,

[00:15:45] so maybe I'm just

[00:15:46] getting my wires crossed.

[00:15:47] I could have sworn

[00:15:47] that there was a trading card.

[00:15:50] I remember he had Lizard,

[00:15:51] and I swear there was

[00:15:52] one named Jack-O'-Lantern,

[00:15:54] but maybe not.

[00:15:55] No, there is.

[00:15:56] I mean, he's got

[00:15:56] Jack-O'-Lantern on his head,

[00:15:57] his first appearance is...

[00:16:00] Ed's looking this up,

[00:16:01] and it sounds like

[00:16:02] this may have been

[00:16:03] a card of a Z-level...

[00:16:04] It's a cool card.

[00:16:06] Yeah.

[00:16:07] Spider-Man villain.

[00:16:08] He's got a cool

[00:16:09] first appearance cover.

[00:16:11] It's literally

[00:16:12] just a Green Goblin ripoff.

[00:16:14] He's got a glider,

[00:16:15] like everything.

[00:16:16] He's got a green suit,

[00:16:17] but he's got a Jack-O'-Lantern,

[00:16:19] flaming Jack-O'-Lantern head

[00:16:20] instead of, you know,

[00:16:22] the Goblin Cowl

[00:16:23] or Mysterio Bull

[00:16:25] or something.

[00:16:26] Real creative guys.

[00:16:28] Yeah.

[00:16:28] I'm willing to bet

[00:16:29] this issue came out

[00:16:30] around October.

[00:16:32] Yeah.

[00:16:32] They're like,

[00:16:33] introducing our new

[00:16:35] Spider-Man villain,

[00:16:37] Scavenger Bird.

[00:16:40] Jack-O'-Lantern

[00:16:41] first appeared

[00:16:42] in the February 1978

[00:16:43] issue of Marvel's

[00:16:45] Machine Man series,

[00:16:46] so it wasn't October,

[00:16:47] and Machine Man

[00:16:49] was canceled that issue.

[00:16:50] So I guess Jack-O'-Lantern

[00:16:51] wasn't much of a success anyway.

[00:16:53] But the story did take place

[00:16:55] during a Halloween party,

[00:16:56] and Jack-O'-Lantern

[00:16:57] would occasionally

[00:16:58] show back up

[00:16:59] in other books

[00:16:59] and on a trading card

[00:17:00] or two.

[00:17:01] Just enough to burn

[00:17:02] into Chris's memory.

[00:17:04] Well, and obviously

[00:17:05] there's the Headless Horseman too,

[00:17:07] but more on him in a bit.

[00:17:08] First, I want to go overseas

[00:17:09] and back in time

[00:17:10] to investigate the origin

[00:17:12] of the term

[00:17:13] Jack-O'-Lantern itself.

[00:17:15] So, I didn't really know

[00:17:17] anything about this

[00:17:17] other than like vaguely,

[00:17:19] I think somewhere in my head,

[00:17:20] I had it categorized

[00:17:23] as there was like

[00:17:23] an Irish component

[00:17:25] to the Jack-O'-Lantern legend.

[00:17:27] So I really didn't know

[00:17:28] where to start.

[00:17:28] Now, I don't know.

[00:17:30] You're going to tell it to me

[00:17:31] in a second,

[00:17:31] but there's a lot

[00:17:33] of Jack-O'-Lantern imagery

[00:17:34] in something that

[00:17:35] Steve and I watch

[00:17:36] every Halloween,

[00:17:37] which is over the garden wall,

[00:17:39] which has a ton

[00:17:40] of great Jack-O'-Lantern imagery.

[00:17:42] And I think a bunch of lore

[00:17:43] about the like

[00:17:45] Inxinguinine,

[00:17:46] Singwazane,

[00:17:46] Singwan.

[00:17:47] Oh, Sawane?

[00:17:48] So yeah,

[00:17:49] there's like a whole

[00:17:49] Sawane thing in that

[00:17:50] or whatever.

[00:17:53] Well, I don't know exactly

[00:17:55] where over the garden wall

[00:17:57] intersects with the history

[00:17:58] of Jack-O'-Lanterns.

[00:18:00] Have you ever seen it?

[00:18:00] No, I haven't.

[00:18:01] It's fucking amazing.

[00:18:02] It's like that

[00:18:04] and Trick or Treat

[00:18:04] are probably the only two

[00:18:06] absolutely have to happen

[00:18:08] at Halloween watches

[00:18:09] in this house.

[00:18:09] Well, it goes on the list then.

[00:18:11] Yeah.

[00:18:11] I'll watch it

[00:18:12] and we'll update

[00:18:13] this episode someday

[00:18:14] with an over the garden wall

[00:18:17] footnote.

[00:18:17] But according to an article

[00:18:19] on mental floss,

[00:18:20] the term Jack-O'-Lantern

[00:18:21] would first apply

[00:18:22] to people,

[00:18:23] not pumpkins.

[00:18:24] As far back as 1663,

[00:18:27] the term meant

[00:18:28] a man with a lantern

[00:18:29] or a night watchman.

[00:18:31] And just a decade or so

[00:18:33] after that

[00:18:33] in the 1670s,

[00:18:35] it began to be used

[00:18:37] to refer to

[00:18:38] the mysterious lights

[00:18:39] sometimes seen at night

[00:18:40] over bogs,

[00:18:41] swamps,

[00:18:42] and marshes.

[00:18:43] These ghost lights,

[00:18:44] variously called

[00:18:45] jack-o'-lanterns,

[00:18:47] hinky punks,

[00:18:48] hobby lanterns,

[00:18:49] corpse candles,

[00:18:50] fairy lights,

[00:18:51] will-o'-the-wisps,

[00:18:52] and fool's fire

[00:18:53] are created

[00:18:54] when gases

[00:18:55] from decomposing

[00:18:56] plant matter

[00:18:56] ignite

[00:18:57] as they come into contact

[00:18:58] with electricity

[00:18:59] or heat

[00:18:59] when they oxidize.

[00:19:01] For centuries,

[00:19:01] before anyone

[00:19:02] knew any of that,

[00:19:04] people just saw

[00:19:05] these glowing lights

[00:19:06] over swamps

[00:19:07] in the distance

[00:19:08] and made up stories

[00:19:10] about them

[00:19:10] to explain them.

[00:19:11] I like corpse candles,

[00:19:13] whatever the hell

[00:19:13] you just said.

[00:19:14] Yeah,

[00:19:14] corpse candles is great,

[00:19:16] hinky punks

[00:19:16] is a weird one.

[00:19:17] Yeah,

[00:19:18] that's a little wacky.

[00:19:19] That's someone

[00:19:20] who didn't quite

[00:19:21] understand what someone said

[00:19:22] but felt just threatened enough

[00:19:24] to not ask them

[00:19:25] to repeat it

[00:19:25] and then went

[00:19:26] and wrote it down

[00:19:27] like whatever census taker

[00:19:28] of language that was.

[00:19:29] It was like,

[00:19:30] and it was,

[00:19:30] you said,

[00:19:30] okay,

[00:19:31] goodbye.

[00:19:32] I had heard fairy lights,

[00:19:34] I had heard

[00:19:34] will-o'-the-wisps,

[00:19:35] but I had never heard

[00:19:37] corpse candles.

[00:19:38] That's a good one.

[00:19:39] Or fool's fire.

[00:19:40] Or fool's fire.

[00:19:41] In Ireland,

[00:19:42] though,

[00:19:42] dating back as far

[00:19:43] as the 1500s,

[00:19:44] the stories people told

[00:19:45] to explain these lights

[00:19:47] often revolved

[00:19:48] around a guy

[00:19:49] named Jack.

[00:19:51] As the story goes,

[00:19:53] Stingy Jack,

[00:19:54] who was often

[00:19:55] a blacksmith

[00:19:56] in these stories,

[00:19:57] invited the devil

[00:19:58] to join him

[00:19:59] for a drink.

[00:20:00] Stingy Jack,

[00:20:02] living up to his name,

[00:20:03] didn't want to pay

[00:20:04] for the drinks

[00:20:04] from his own pocket

[00:20:05] and convinced the devil

[00:20:07] to turn himself

[00:20:08] into a coin

[00:20:10] that could be used

[00:20:11] to settle the tab.

[00:20:12] Wow.

[00:20:13] Now, the devil did this,

[00:20:14] but Jack skipped out

[00:20:15] on the bill

[00:20:16] and kept the devil coin

[00:20:17] in his pocket

[00:20:18] along with a silver cross

[00:20:20] that prevented the devil

[00:20:22] from shifting back

[00:20:23] to his original form.

[00:20:25] So already,

[00:20:25] this has got to be

[00:20:26] one of the most complex schemes

[00:20:28] ever pulled

[00:20:29] on the devil himself.

[00:20:30] I mean, no,

[00:20:31] he's one of the all-time great

[00:20:32] Twilight Zone episodes,

[00:20:34] like The Howling Man

[00:20:35] or whatever it's called.

[00:20:36] Mm-hmm.

[00:20:37] That's like a good

[00:20:38] We Caught the Devil.

[00:20:40] Like, the devil's out there

[00:20:41] getting...

[00:20:41] Dude, fucking that guy

[00:20:42] played fiddle pretty mediocre

[00:20:43] and like beat him.

[00:20:45] Yeah.

[00:20:45] Like Charlie...

[00:20:46] But I just mean the level

[00:20:47] of like,

[00:20:48] first of all,

[00:20:48] inviting the devil out

[00:20:49] for a drink

[00:20:50] in these legends

[00:20:51] apparently unprompted.

[00:20:52] So we don't know

[00:20:53] where Jack met the devil.

[00:20:54] We don't know how well

[00:20:55] they knew each other,

[00:20:56] but he was like,

[00:20:56] hey man,

[00:20:57] let's go get a drink.

[00:20:58] And then deciding

[00:21:00] that he didn't want

[00:21:01] to pay for the drinks

[00:21:02] and that his only recourse

[00:21:04] for that

[00:21:04] was to trick the devil

[00:21:06] into turning himself

[00:21:07] into a coin

[00:21:09] with which he could

[00:21:10] pay for the drinks.

[00:21:11] Yeah, it's weird

[00:21:11] that he's not like,

[00:21:12] hey, can you get this?

[00:21:13] And the devil

[00:21:13] would just say,

[00:21:14] okay.

[00:21:14] Yeah.

[00:21:15] It's like, no,

[00:21:15] how about let me turn

[00:21:16] into what you can get

[00:21:17] this with?

[00:21:18] Yes.

[00:21:19] Which, considering

[00:21:20] the devil is well known

[00:21:21] for the deals

[00:21:23] one can make with him,

[00:21:24] it seems like

[00:21:25] it would be a pretty

[00:21:26] straightforward trade.

[00:21:28] But anyway...

[00:21:28] Yeah, he didn't have to

[00:21:29] wonder twins

[00:21:30] his way out of this.

[00:21:31] He really didn't.

[00:21:32] It was...

[00:21:32] It's quite simple.

[00:21:33] Or, even better,

[00:21:34] if you want to keep your soul,

[00:21:35] you don't want to make

[00:21:36] a deal with the devil,

[00:21:37] you could probably,

[00:21:37] since you're seemingly buds,

[00:21:40] just trick another guy

[00:21:41] into giving you a coin.

[00:21:43] Yeah.

[00:21:43] How much do these drinks cost?

[00:21:45] They wouldn't buy pens.

[00:21:45] Fucking bucks for it.

[00:21:46] Yeah.

[00:21:46] Do you ever watch

[00:21:48] Metalocalypse?

[00:21:48] I mean,

[00:21:49] I've seen scattered episodes.

[00:21:50] I love it so much,

[00:21:52] but there's an episode

[00:21:52] where they do a deal

[00:21:54] with the devil,

[00:21:55] like, for their soul,

[00:21:55] like a crossroads deal

[00:21:56] with the devil.

[00:21:57] And the devil, like,

[00:21:58] thinks he has them on this,

[00:21:59] like, give me your soul now.

[00:22:01] But they're so used

[00:22:02] to insane contracts

[00:22:04] that they actually

[00:22:06] not only, like,

[00:22:07] get one over on the devil,

[00:22:09] they don't have to

[00:22:10] give them their soul.

[00:22:11] They have to give them,

[00:22:11] like, a $25 Hot Topic

[00:22:13] gift card or something.

[00:22:15] It was just...

[00:22:15] But the whole idea

[00:22:16] is just that, like,

[00:22:17] the devil's like,

[00:22:17] I got you now.

[00:22:18] And they're like,

[00:22:18] actually, we had our lawyers

[00:22:20] take a look at this contract

[00:22:21] type of thing.

[00:22:21] So what I'm getting at

[00:22:22] is in popular culture,

[00:22:24] the devil's like an idiot.

[00:22:25] He's a fool.

[00:22:26] He's a fool.

[00:22:26] It's his fire.

[00:22:28] Fool's fire.

[00:22:29] Which is weird

[00:22:29] because actually where he is

[00:22:30] in the thinking hell,

[00:22:31] it's all ice.

[00:22:32] There's no fire down there.

[00:22:33] He's stuck in the ice

[00:22:34] in the bottom level of hell.

[00:22:35] What?

[00:22:35] Isn't that where the devil is?

[00:22:36] In, like, Dante's Inferno?

[00:22:38] Oh, oh, oh.

[00:22:38] He's, like, up to his waist

[00:22:40] in ice just sitting down there

[00:22:41] with all the traitors.

[00:22:43] Well, in this case,

[00:22:44] he's up to his waist

[00:22:46] in someone else's waist.

[00:22:48] Oh, yeah.

[00:22:48] In his coin purse

[00:22:52] next to a silver cross.

[00:22:53] He just signed a lease

[00:22:54] to live in a pocket.

[00:22:55] Yeah.

[00:22:56] So Jack here,

[00:22:57] he's got the devil

[00:22:58] in his pocket

[00:23:00] and won't let him

[00:23:01] turn back into the devil.

[00:23:03] Now, Jack eventually

[00:23:05] lets the devil loose,

[00:23:06] but only after the devil

[00:23:07] promises that he won't

[00:23:09] seek revenge on Jack

[00:23:10] and won't claim his soul

[00:23:11] when he dies.

[00:23:12] Oh, my God.

[00:23:13] You have to sign an NDA?

[00:23:15] Basically.

[00:23:15] Basically.

[00:23:16] So now it gets

[00:23:17] even a little bit

[00:23:17] more complicated

[00:23:18] because after Jack

[00:23:20] has had this devil

[00:23:21] in his pocket,

[00:23:22] he irks the devil again

[00:23:23] by convincing him

[00:23:25] to climb a tree

[00:23:26] to pick some fruit

[00:23:27] and then carves

[00:23:28] the cross into the trunk

[00:23:29] so the devil

[00:23:30] can't climb back down.

[00:23:32] Oh, my God.

[00:23:32] The devil can't.

[00:23:34] He's had a real problem

[00:23:35] with crosses.

[00:23:36] Well, this is some

[00:23:36] real Bugs Bunny shit

[00:23:37] and it's making me think

[00:23:39] the Irish devil

[00:23:40] is maybe less cool

[00:23:41] than the regular devil.

[00:23:42] You think every nation

[00:23:43] has their own devil?

[00:23:44] I don't know.

[00:23:45] I mean, this one,

[00:23:46] the guy in this story

[00:23:47] seems like a doofus.

[00:23:49] He's tricked twice

[00:23:50] by a guy who seems

[00:23:52] like a stingy drunk.

[00:23:54] Yeah, fool me once.

[00:23:54] Shame on me.

[00:23:55] Fool me twice.

[00:23:56] I'm the actual devil.

[00:23:58] But also,

[00:24:00] I love how Stingy Jack

[00:24:02] and just like deadbeat people,

[00:24:04] it's like the fucking amount

[00:24:06] of work they'll do

[00:24:07] to like just not get a job

[00:24:09] or not earn honest money.

[00:24:10] Like the cons they'll pull,

[00:24:13] the slip and falls,

[00:24:14] the whatever.

[00:24:14] Everything to just not

[00:24:16] get a nine to five.

[00:24:17] Yeah.

[00:24:17] And it was like,

[00:24:18] bro, you could have bought

[00:24:19] this drink all the time

[00:24:20] climbing trees

[00:24:21] and doing fruit,

[00:24:22] carving crosses.

[00:24:23] You could have just fucking

[00:24:24] did some manual labor

[00:24:26] for two hours

[00:24:27] and be fucking

[00:24:27] way steep in beers.

[00:24:28] the bar back.

[00:24:29] Could have just

[00:24:29] bought some drinks.

[00:24:31] Whatever happened

[00:24:31] to that time period

[00:24:32] in history

[00:24:32] that movies always show us

[00:24:34] where it's like

[00:24:34] can't afford the bill

[00:24:35] hard cut to like them

[00:24:36] working in the kitchen.

[00:24:37] Yeah.

[00:24:37] Well, anyway,

[00:24:39] Jack freed him again

[00:24:40] on the condition

[00:24:41] that the devil

[00:24:42] just eat this shit

[00:24:44] and not take revenge

[00:24:45] and not claim Jack's soul.

[00:24:47] So we've got a real,

[00:24:48] a cucked devil.

[00:24:49] For real, dude.

[00:24:50] This dude fucking.

[00:24:52] But here's what I love

[00:24:53] about this story

[00:24:54] because I think

[00:24:54] this is a great twist

[00:24:55] and honestly,

[00:24:56] I'm claiming this

[00:24:57] if you're listening,

[00:24:58] you're not allowed

[00:24:58] to use this.

[00:24:59] This is a great origin story

[00:25:00] I think for a,

[00:25:02] like a mystery

[00:25:04] of the week type character

[00:25:05] on a TV show.

[00:25:06] So when Stingy Jack

[00:25:08] eventually died,

[00:25:09] he was so stingy

[00:25:11] that God wouldn't

[00:25:12] allow him into heaven.

[00:25:13] So he went to hell

[00:25:15] but the devil was like,

[00:25:17] hey man,

[00:25:17] you made me promise you

[00:25:18] not to let you in here

[00:25:20] so I'm not letting you in.

[00:25:22] Instead,

[00:25:23] the devil gave him

[00:25:23] a single burning coal

[00:25:25] to light his way

[00:25:26] and sent him off

[00:25:26] into the night

[00:25:27] to quote,

[00:25:28] find his own hell.

[00:25:29] Oh wow.

[00:25:30] So Jack became

[00:25:31] this immortal light

[00:25:32] wandering the countryside.

[00:25:34] That is an awesome

[00:25:35] origin story.

[00:25:35] I bet you Stanley

[00:25:36] did use it somewhere

[00:25:37] because he was very well read.

[00:25:38] And it's just so,

[00:25:39] I love the idea

[00:25:40] of like a guy

[00:25:41] who's too tricky for hell

[00:25:43] and too stingy for heaven.

[00:25:45] Do you think the stingy

[00:25:45] for heaven thing

[00:25:46] was like,

[00:25:47] you were so fucking

[00:25:48] tight-fisted

[00:25:49] that there's no way

[00:25:49] you like did anything

[00:25:50] good for anyone?

[00:25:52] I get,

[00:25:52] I mean,

[00:25:52] I think it's just heaven

[00:25:53] like,

[00:25:54] yeah,

[00:25:54] we got pearly gates

[00:25:55] and they're pearly

[00:25:55] because it's 25 bucks

[00:25:56] to get in.

[00:25:57] I don't know.

[00:25:58] I mean,

[00:25:59] I think it's just generally

[00:26:00] this guy is sort of

[00:26:01] such a scumbag

[00:26:02] that he couldn't go anywhere

[00:26:04] and just ended up

[00:26:05] being an immortal scumbag.

[00:26:07] Yeah.

[00:26:07] It's the cool origin story

[00:26:08] that should get used

[00:26:09] by me

[00:26:10] and not you,

[00:26:11] listener,

[00:26:12] by me.

[00:26:12] Don't try and stingy jack

[00:26:13] our listeners.

[00:26:15] So anyway,

[00:26:16] where this all ties

[00:26:17] into the idea

[00:26:18] of pumpkins

[00:26:19] and jack-o'-lanterns

[00:26:20] is that Jack

[00:26:21] took this coal

[00:26:22] that the devil gave him

[00:26:23] to roam

[00:26:24] and find his own hell

[00:26:25] and he put it

[00:26:26] into a carved out turnip

[00:26:28] and has supposedly

[00:26:29] been roaming the earth

[00:26:31] through that ever since.

[00:26:32] In Ireland,

[00:26:33] the ghost lights

[00:26:33] seen in the swamps

[00:26:34] were said to be

[00:26:35] Jack's improvised lantern

[00:26:37] moving about

[00:26:38] as his restless soul

[00:26:39] wandered the countryside

[00:26:40] and thus

[00:26:41] the lights were dubbed

[00:26:42] Jack of the Lantern

[00:26:44] or Jack O' Lantern.

[00:26:45] Did you watch Bodkin?

[00:26:47] The like Forte show

[00:26:48] that was in Ireland.

[00:26:49] That's like a plot point

[00:26:50] is like this like

[00:26:51] A ghost light?

[00:26:52] Yeah,

[00:26:52] there's a ghost light

[00:26:53] like in a swamp

[00:26:54] or whatever

[00:26:54] and it's,

[00:26:55] you know,

[00:26:55] part of a crime scene thing

[00:26:57] but people like

[00:26:58] don't take it seriously

[00:26:58] because he was like

[00:26:59] it was Jack O' Lantern

[00:27:00] or whatever

[00:27:01] it was.

[00:27:02] Maybe I didn't call him

[00:27:03] Jack Lantern

[00:27:03] but what you just described

[00:27:05] is like what they're like

[00:27:06] they were like

[00:27:06] oh he's just some fucking drunk

[00:27:07] right,

[00:27:08] like talking about that

[00:27:09] but yeah,

[00:27:10] it was a swamp

[00:27:10] it was all that

[00:27:11] it was in Ireland

[00:27:11] so you gotta watch

[00:27:13] more shit man.

[00:27:14] Dude,

[00:27:14] as our listeners know

[00:27:16] I've had a bit

[00:27:16] of a busy couple of months

[00:27:18] so.

[00:27:19] Yeah,

[00:27:19] the things I'm talking about

[00:27:20] are years old

[00:27:21] other than Bodkin.

[00:27:22] So I also found

[00:27:23] this awesome

[00:27:24] secondhand account

[00:27:25] from the Irish Times

[00:27:26] that quotes an article

[00:27:28] from the 1836 edition

[00:27:30] of the Dublin Penny Journal

[00:27:32] that describes

[00:27:33] Jack O' Lantern

[00:27:34] and I thought this was good

[00:27:35] so I'm quoting here

[00:27:36] the author

[00:27:37] when traveling

[00:27:38] with his excessively

[00:27:39] talkative uncle

[00:27:40] the worst kind of uncle

[00:27:42] through a dark night

[00:27:43] is confronted

[00:27:44] by the phenomenon

[00:27:45] of Jack O' Lantern

[00:27:47] his uncle

[00:27:47] tells the tale

[00:27:48] of Jack O' the Lantern

[00:27:50] showing his pity

[00:27:51] for this cursed figure

[00:27:52] doomed to wander

[00:27:53] with his lantern.

[00:27:54] The uncle says

[00:27:55] quote

[00:27:56] if you knew

[00:27:57] the sufferings

[00:27:58] of that forsaken

[00:27:59] Krather

[00:27:59] spelled C-R-A-Y-T-H-U-R

[00:28:03] since the time

[00:28:04] the poor soul

[00:28:05] was doomed

[00:28:06] to wander

[00:28:06] with a lantern

[00:28:07] in his hand

[00:28:08] on this cold earth

[00:28:09] without rest

[00:28:10] for his foot

[00:28:11] or shelter

[00:28:12] for his head

[00:28:13] until the day

[00:28:14] of judgment

[00:28:14] oh it had softened

[00:28:16] the heart of stone

[00:28:17] to see him

[00:28:18] as I once did

[00:28:19] the poor old

[00:28:20] Dunawan

[00:28:21] his feet blistered

[00:28:23] and bleeding

[00:28:23] his ponines

[00:28:25] or rags

[00:28:26] all flying about him

[00:28:27] and the reins

[00:28:28] of heaven

[00:28:29] beating on his

[00:28:30] old white head

[00:28:31] I just asked you

[00:28:33] do you think

[00:28:34] it's a good time

[00:28:34] to stop for dinner

[00:28:35] and you told me

[00:28:36] this whole crazy story

[00:28:36] you talking of uncle

[00:28:38] so that's what

[00:28:38] Jack O' Lantern

[00:28:39] looked like I guess

[00:28:40] a real crazy

[00:28:41] fucking lunatic

[00:28:41] wandering the

[00:28:43] the countrysides

[00:28:44] this tradition

[00:28:45] continued to evolve

[00:28:47] the tradition

[00:28:48] of the idea

[00:28:48] of Jack O' Lantern

[00:28:49] when Irish immigrants

[00:28:51] began settling

[00:28:52] in the new world

[00:28:53] making vegetable

[00:28:54] lanterns

[00:28:55] was a tradition

[00:28:55] of the British Isles

[00:28:57] and carved out

[00:28:57] turnips

[00:28:58] beets

[00:28:58] and potatoes

[00:28:59] were stuffed

[00:29:00] with coal

[00:29:01] wood embers

[00:29:02] or candles

[00:29:02] as impromptu

[00:29:04] lanterns

[00:29:04] to celebrate

[00:29:05] this fall harvest

[00:29:06] that's interesting

[00:29:07] considering

[00:29:08] like Europe

[00:29:08] does not go hard

[00:29:10] for fucking Halloween

[00:29:11] well

[00:29:12] they brought it

[00:29:13] with them

[00:29:13] to the new world

[00:29:14] they don't go

[00:29:15] they don't go hard

[00:29:15] for modern Halloween

[00:29:17] but they do have

[00:29:18] a whole history

[00:29:19] of you know

[00:29:20] harvest time

[00:29:21] legends

[00:29:22] and myths

[00:29:23] and rumors

[00:29:23] and that period

[00:29:24] of sawing

[00:29:25] when the veil

[00:29:26] between the living

[00:29:27] and the dead

[00:29:27] grows thin

[00:29:28] I think

[00:29:28] they don't have

[00:29:29] as commercial

[00:29:31] of Halloween

[00:29:32] but these things

[00:29:33] that's because

[00:29:34] they're from the

[00:29:34] lineage of

[00:29:35] tight-fisted Joe

[00:29:36] whatever his name is

[00:29:37] stingy jack

[00:29:38] stingy jack

[00:29:38] the whole nation

[00:29:39] is stingy jacks

[00:29:40] you don't want to

[00:29:40] put up a fucking

[00:29:41] decoration or two

[00:29:42] they won't hand out

[00:29:43] candy

[00:29:43] they won't put up

[00:29:44] decorations

[00:29:45] and they're so

[00:29:46] close to Cadbury

[00:29:47] which is delicious

[00:29:47] candy

[00:29:48] they will carve

[00:29:49] these absolutely

[00:29:50] heinous looking

[00:29:52] turnip faces

[00:29:53] these turnip lanterns

[00:29:55] Ed

[00:29:55] I want you

[00:29:57] to take a look

[00:29:57] at this thing

[00:29:58] nope

[00:29:59] that is

[00:30:00] that looks like

[00:30:01] the cover

[00:30:02] of communion

[00:30:03] it does

[00:30:04] it does

[00:30:05] maybe I'll

[00:30:06] photoshop that

[00:30:07] or something

[00:30:07] it's kind of

[00:30:08] like the cover

[00:30:08] of communion

[00:30:09] meets a series

[00:30:11] of like

[00:30:12] we thought

[00:30:12] we'd have

[00:30:13] a bigger budget

[00:30:13] schlock

[00:30:14] special effects

[00:30:15] makeup

[00:30:15] look at this one

[00:30:16] this one looks

[00:30:17] like a slipknot

[00:30:17] mask

[00:30:18] I will

[00:30:20] I will say

[00:30:22] that of the two

[00:30:23] you've shown me

[00:30:23] they're pretty

[00:30:24] fucking similar

[00:30:25] yeah

[00:30:25] so like

[00:30:26] it really is

[00:30:27] like

[00:30:27] they have a

[00:30:28] plan

[00:30:28] here

[00:30:29] which is like

[00:30:30] did you all

[00:30:30] make a statue

[00:30:31] of the thing

[00:30:32] we are for sure

[00:30:32] saw once

[00:30:33] like because

[00:30:34] you know what I

[00:30:34] mean

[00:30:35] they're so

[00:30:35] similar

[00:30:36] well yeah

[00:30:37] I don't know

[00:30:37] how many of

[00:30:38] these survived

[00:30:38] I think both

[00:30:39] of these photos

[00:30:40] and the links

[00:30:40] of course

[00:30:41] are in the

[00:30:41] show notes

[00:30:42] I think both

[00:30:43] of these photos

[00:30:43] might be from

[00:30:44] the same

[00:30:45] collection

[00:30:46] at whatever

[00:30:46] museum

[00:30:47] they're currently

[00:30:48] at

[00:30:48] but no wonder

[00:30:49] that we

[00:30:50] transitioned to

[00:30:51] pumpkins

[00:30:51] I mean I guess

[00:30:52] part of it too

[00:30:53] is when you're

[00:30:53] carving a turnip

[00:30:54] you don't have

[00:30:54] a ton of real

[00:30:55] estate

[00:30:55] so the face

[00:30:56] becomes

[00:30:56] very close

[00:30:57] together

[00:30:57] very yeah

[00:30:58] like scrunched

[00:30:59] and that's part

[00:31:00] of what makes

[00:31:00] it look so weird

[00:31:01] well there was

[00:31:01] nothing next to

[00:31:02] that picture

[00:31:03] you showed me

[00:31:03] I don't know

[00:31:04] if that was

[00:31:04] the size

[00:31:04] of a normal

[00:31:05] pumpkin

[00:31:05] or if a

[00:31:06] turnip's

[00:31:06] the size

[00:31:06] of a fist

[00:31:07] no turnips

[00:31:08] are pretty

[00:31:08] small

[00:31:09] that's what

[00:31:09] I thought

[00:31:09] I think

[00:31:10] it's like

[00:31:10] the size

[00:31:10] of a fist

[00:31:11] probably

[00:31:11] that's a

[00:31:11] super mario

[00:31:12] brothers 2

[00:31:12] which case

[00:31:13] he holds

[00:31:13] them over

[00:31:14] his head

[00:31:14] they're fucking

[00:31:14] huge

[00:31:15] apparently

[00:31:17] as a prank

[00:31:18] kids would

[00:31:19] sometimes wander

[00:31:20] off the road

[00:31:21] with one of

[00:31:21] these glowing

[00:31:22] vegetables

[00:31:22] to trick their

[00:31:23] friends and

[00:31:24] travelers into

[00:31:25] thinking that

[00:31:25] they were

[00:31:25] stingy jack

[00:31:26] or another

[00:31:27] lost soul

[00:31:28] which it

[00:31:28] would work

[00:31:29] on me

[00:31:29] yeah

[00:31:30] if I saw

[00:31:30] one of

[00:31:31] these

[00:31:31] fucking

[00:31:31] things

[00:31:31] flying out

[00:31:32] of the dark

[00:31:33] in America

[00:31:34] pumpkins were

[00:31:36] easier to

[00:31:36] come by

[00:31:37] and good

[00:31:37] for carving

[00:31:38] and so

[00:31:38] they kind

[00:31:38] of got

[00:31:39] absorbed

[00:31:39] in the

[00:31:40] carved

[00:31:40] lantern

[00:31:41] tradition

[00:31:41] and the

[00:31:42] associated

[00:31:42] prank

[00:31:43] over time

[00:31:45] kids refined

[00:31:46] this prank

[00:31:46] and began

[00:31:47] carving more

[00:31:48] complex faces

[00:31:49] into the

[00:31:50] pumpkins

[00:31:50] which if you

[00:31:51] ask me

[00:31:52] I think

[00:31:52] if you ask

[00:31:52] either of

[00:31:53] us

[00:31:53] may have

[00:31:54] diluted

[00:31:55] the prank

[00:31:55] to some

[00:31:56] degree

[00:31:56] because even

[00:31:57] if the face

[00:31:58] was more

[00:31:58] complex

[00:31:59] it wasn't

[00:31:59] as creepy

[00:32:00] no that

[00:32:00] those uncomplex

[00:32:02] simple

[00:32:04] monstrous

[00:32:04] mutant

[00:32:05] fucking

[00:32:05] turnip heads

[00:32:06] you just showed

[00:32:07] me

[00:32:07] but the thing

[00:32:07] that's different

[00:32:08] is I have

[00:32:09] never looked

[00:32:09] at a pumpkin

[00:32:10] a carved

[00:32:11] pumpkin

[00:32:11] and been

[00:32:11] like that

[00:32:12] kind of

[00:32:12] looks like

[00:32:13] Charles

[00:32:13] or something

[00:32:14] those turnips

[00:32:15] they feel

[00:32:16] like they

[00:32:16] should have

[00:32:16] names

[00:32:17] yeah

[00:32:17] like they

[00:32:18] look like

[00:32:18] that could

[00:32:19] have

[00:32:19] like I said

[00:32:19] that could

[00:32:20] have been

[00:32:20] like before

[00:32:21] sketch artists

[00:32:21] they had

[00:32:22] turnip

[00:32:22] carvers

[00:32:23] who were

[00:32:23] like this

[00:32:24] is the

[00:32:24] man

[00:32:24] who stole

[00:32:25] our

[00:32:25] cows

[00:32:26] yeah

[00:32:26] and then

[00:32:27] pumpkins

[00:32:28] just

[00:32:28] what

[00:32:28] maybe

[00:32:29] are we

[00:32:29] getting to

[00:32:30] the

[00:32:30] just the

[00:32:30] unbelievable

[00:32:31] life

[00:32:32] that pumpkins

[00:32:32] have

[00:32:33] what do

[00:32:33] you mean

[00:32:33] oh

[00:32:34] it's just

[00:32:34] kind of

[00:32:34] feeling

[00:32:34] September

[00:32:35] 1st

[00:32:36] pumpkins

[00:32:36] are such

[00:32:37] a like

[00:32:38] weird flex

[00:32:39] but okay

[00:32:39] gourd

[00:32:40] in the sense

[00:32:41] that it's

[00:32:41] like boom

[00:32:42] people are

[00:32:42] lining up

[00:32:43] at Starbucks

[00:32:43] for the

[00:32:44] pumpkin spice

[00:32:44] latte

[00:32:45] pumpkin pies

[00:32:46] are gonna

[00:32:46] come around

[00:32:46] the corner

[00:32:47] in November

[00:32:47] for Thanksgiving

[00:32:48] carve our

[00:32:49] fucking heads

[00:32:50] like if you

[00:32:50] have a pumpkin

[00:32:51] patch

[00:32:52] you probably

[00:32:53] have nothing

[00:32:53] left over

[00:32:54] at the end

[00:32:54] of the year

[00:32:55] it's gotta

[00:32:55] be an amazing

[00:32:55] yeah

[00:32:56] well it's

[00:32:56] like Christmas

[00:32:57] trees

[00:32:57] or like

[00:32:58] and I also

[00:32:58] think in LA

[00:32:59] we see a lot

[00:33:00] more of it

[00:33:01] because it's

[00:33:01] the only thing

[00:33:02] that makes you

[00:33:03] feel like the

[00:33:04] seasons are

[00:33:04] changing

[00:33:05] yeah

[00:33:05] like we need

[00:33:06] to lay that

[00:33:07] out

[00:33:07] yeah like we

[00:33:08] need those

[00:33:08] pumpkins

[00:33:09] we need that

[00:33:09] pumpkin spice

[00:33:10] I mean I'm

[00:33:11] even a

[00:33:11] I succumb to

[00:33:12] the pumpkin

[00:33:13] spice trend

[00:33:14] because it's

[00:33:15] the only thing

[00:33:16] that makes me

[00:33:16] feel like it's

[00:33:17] fall now is

[00:33:18] I'm having all

[00:33:19] these pumpkin

[00:33:19] spice which

[00:33:20] let's be real

[00:33:21] it's all mostly

[00:33:22] more like a

[00:33:23] vanilla cinnamon

[00:33:24] there's very little

[00:33:25] pumpkin flavor

[00:33:26] in a lot of that

[00:33:27] pumpkin

[00:33:28] I found a seed

[00:33:28] in mine

[00:33:29] so I don't

[00:33:29] know

[00:33:30] no I

[00:33:31] yeah it's

[00:33:31] true

[00:33:32] Los Angeles

[00:33:32] is weird

[00:33:33] like if you're

[00:33:33] if that 12

[00:33:35] foot Home Depot

[00:33:36] skeleton wasn't

[00:33:37] in the yard

[00:33:37] with you

[00:33:38] you'd think it

[00:33:39] was July

[00:33:40] I'm sorry

[00:33:40] you'd think it

[00:33:41] was July

[00:33:41] yeah

[00:33:41] so anyway

[00:33:42] kids refined

[00:33:43] the prank

[00:33:44] they started

[00:33:45] carving more

[00:33:45] complex faces

[00:33:46] which I'll also

[00:33:47] say one of the

[00:33:48] reasons I think

[00:33:48] these less

[00:33:49] complex faces

[00:33:50] are scary

[00:33:50] is it's sort

[00:33:51] of to go

[00:33:52] back to Michael

[00:33:52] Myers for a

[00:33:53] second

[00:33:53] it's the

[00:33:54] simplicity

[00:33:54] it's the

[00:33:55] blankness

[00:33:55] is part of

[00:33:56] what makes

[00:33:56] it so creepy

[00:33:57] you know

[00:33:57] once you put

[00:33:58] like the

[00:33:58] snaggle tooth

[00:33:59] in the smile

[00:34:00] it's now

[00:34:00] a more specific

[00:34:01] image

[00:34:02] and thus

[00:34:03] less mystery

[00:34:04] can be read

[00:34:05] into it

[00:34:06] yeah do you

[00:34:07] um do you

[00:34:07] remember the last

[00:34:08] thing you carved

[00:34:09] like what was

[00:34:10] the last face

[00:34:10] you chose

[00:34:11] I usually like

[00:34:12] to do jagged teeth

[00:34:13] okay

[00:34:14] I do like

[00:34:14] triangle eyes

[00:34:15] triangle nose

[00:34:16] and then jagged teeth

[00:34:17] because I'm not a

[00:34:17] very good pumpkin

[00:34:18] carver

[00:34:19] well jagged teeth

[00:34:19] are also basically

[00:34:20] triangles

[00:34:21] you took an

[00:34:21] all triangle approach

[00:34:22] yeah all triangle

[00:34:23] approach

[00:34:23] I did

[00:34:24] do you remember

[00:34:25] when I did

[00:34:25] it might be the

[00:34:26] last time I

[00:34:27] I did

[00:34:27] at any kind

[00:34:28] of pumpkin

[00:34:28] carving

[00:34:29] on the show

[00:34:30] I used to have

[00:34:30] everyone's the worst

[00:34:31] we did the

[00:34:32] everyone's the worst

[00:34:32] like I did the

[00:34:33] everyone's the worst

[00:34:34] logo

[00:34:34] yes

[00:34:35] in a pumpkin

[00:34:36] and it came out

[00:34:37] pretty good

[00:34:37] yeah well

[00:34:38] I mean I think

[00:34:39] if you take the

[00:34:39] step of like

[00:34:40] getting um

[00:34:41] trace paper

[00:34:42] and whatever

[00:34:42] like you can

[00:34:43] you can go to

[00:34:43] the store

[00:34:44] and buy those

[00:34:44] too

[00:34:45] you lay them

[00:34:45] over a pumpkin

[00:34:46] yeah but that

[00:34:46] was my first

[00:34:47] time doing

[00:34:47] like a thing

[00:34:48] where you just

[00:34:48] kind of shave

[00:34:49] down parts

[00:34:50] so you just like

[00:34:51] create

[00:34:52] but just now

[00:34:53] gotten completely

[00:34:54] away like at

[00:34:54] that point

[00:34:55] it's just my

[00:34:55] canvas

[00:34:56] it has nothing

[00:34:57] to do at all

[00:34:57] with faces

[00:34:58] or lore

[00:34:59] or scariness

[00:34:59] super complex

[00:35:01] super detailed

[00:35:02] beautiful pumpkin

[00:35:03] carvings with like

[00:35:04] that shaving method

[00:35:05] where they're like

[00:35:06] really intricate

[00:35:07] and they'll do

[00:35:08] whole like portraits

[00:35:08] of Boris Karloff

[00:35:10] or whatever

[00:35:10] yeah

[00:35:10] then it's just

[00:35:11] a canvas

[00:35:12] it's like

[00:35:12] I mean to me

[00:35:13] it's you know

[00:35:13] I always go back

[00:35:14] to the simplicity

[00:35:15] of like you know

[00:35:16] I want to

[00:35:16] you're stabbing a

[00:35:18] knife into the pumpkin

[00:35:19] you're drawing a

[00:35:20] couple of lines

[00:35:20] with it

[00:35:21] and then that's

[00:35:21] that's it

[00:35:22] yeah

[00:35:26] I don't know

[00:35:26] if you know

[00:35:27] this Ed

[00:35:27] but there are

[00:35:28] a lot of

[00:35:28] podcasts out

[00:35:29] there that

[00:35:29] cover topics

[00:35:30] that are kind

[00:35:31] of similar

[00:35:31] to ours

[00:35:32] things like

[00:35:32] conspiracies

[00:35:33] aliens

[00:35:34] time travel

[00:35:35] and ancient

[00:35:35] civilizations

[00:35:36] first I'm hearing

[00:35:37] of it

[00:35:37] I thought we

[00:35:38] were the only

[00:35:38] ones

[00:35:38] no

[00:35:39] no no no

[00:35:39] trust me

[00:35:40] I know

[00:35:40] that we

[00:35:41] aren't

[00:35:41] because I've

[00:35:41] been listening

[00:35:42] to one of

[00:35:42] these shows

[00:35:43] for a couple

[00:35:43] of years

[00:35:43] now

[00:35:44] it's called

[00:35:45] The Y

[00:35:45] Files

[00:35:46] and let me

[00:35:46] tell you

[00:35:47] it's great

[00:35:48] if you like

[00:35:48] our show

[00:35:49] The Y

[00:35:49] Files

[00:35:50] is going to

[00:35:50] be right up

[00:35:51] your alley

[00:35:51] I personally

[00:35:52] love it

[00:35:53] because some

[00:35:53] podcasts

[00:35:54] I think they

[00:35:55] take these

[00:35:55] topics way

[00:35:56] too seriously

[00:35:56] they believe

[00:35:57] every detail

[00:35:58] even if the

[00:35:59] details don't

[00:36:00] quite add up

[00:36:01] and when that

[00:36:02] happens

[00:36:02] you lost me

[00:36:03] other podcasts

[00:36:04] tear the stories

[00:36:05] apart

[00:36:05] which

[00:36:06] guilty as

[00:36:06] charged

[00:36:07] we've done

[00:36:07] that before

[00:36:08] but The Y

[00:36:08] Files

[00:36:09] is different

[00:36:10] each episode

[00:36:11] starts with an

[00:36:12] exploration of

[00:36:12] the mystery at

[00:36:13] hand

[00:36:13] and then host

[00:36:14] AJ Gentile

[00:36:15] tries to

[00:36:15] separate fact

[00:36:16] from fiction

[00:36:17] and see what's

[00:36:18] left

[00:36:18] all with a little

[00:36:19] bit of help

[00:36:19] from his pal

[00:36:20] Hecklefish

[00:36:20] who's sort

[00:36:22] of like Ed

[00:36:22] if Ed

[00:36:23] were a fish

[00:36:25] it sounds weird

[00:36:25] but it works

[00:36:26] I wouldn't be

[00:36:27] caught dead

[00:36:27] being a fish

[00:36:28] Chris

[00:36:28] but uh

[00:36:29] that said

[00:36:29] do they ever

[00:36:30] find any

[00:36:30] legends

[00:36:30] that they

[00:36:31] can't like

[00:36:31] debunk at

[00:36:32] all or

[00:36:32] oh yeah

[00:36:33] and those

[00:36:33] are really

[00:36:34] some of my

[00:36:34] favorite episodes

[00:36:35] AJ gets his

[00:36:36] worldview challenged

[00:36:37] on the reg

[00:36:38] and it's fun

[00:36:38] to hear

[00:36:39] how his

[00:36:39] thoughts

[00:36:39] grow and

[00:36:40] evolve along

[00:36:41] with the

[00:36:41] subjects

[00:36:42] so if that

[00:36:42] sounds up

[00:36:43] your alley

[00:36:43] check out

[00:36:44] The Y

[00:36:44] Files on

[00:36:45] YouTube

[00:36:45] which is

[00:36:46] where I

[00:36:46] watch it

[00:36:46] along with

[00:36:47] the rest

[00:36:47] of their

[00:36:48] nearly four

[00:36:48] and a half

[00:36:49] million

[00:36:49] subscribers

[00:36:50] or if you

[00:36:51] just want

[00:36:51] the audio

[00:36:52] version

[00:36:52] you can find

[00:36:53] The Y

[00:36:53] Files on

[00:36:54] Spotify

[00:36:54] or anywhere

[00:36:55] you get

[00:36:56] your podcasts

[00:36:56] The X

[00:36:57] Files said

[00:36:58] the truth

[00:36:58] is out there

[00:36:59] but The Y

[00:37:00] Files says

[00:37:01] the truth

[00:37:01] is right here

[00:37:05] so I want

[00:37:06] to pause

[00:37:06] here at the

[00:37:07] point where

[00:37:08] jack-o'-lanterns

[00:37:09] became pumpkin

[00:37:10] based instead

[00:37:11] of stingy

[00:37:12] based or

[00:37:13] turnip

[00:37:13] based and

[00:37:14] consider a

[00:37:15] couple of

[00:37:16] other elements

[00:37:17] that I found

[00:37:18] in my research

[00:37:19] that play into

[00:37:20] the jack-o'-lantern

[00:37:20] story

[00:37:21] the first detail

[00:37:22] I want to

[00:37:23] discuss is an

[00:37:24] alternate explanation

[00:37:25] for the history

[00:37:26] of jack-o'-lanterns

[00:37:27] that I found on

[00:37:27] a very questionable

[00:37:29] website called

[00:37:30] the Western

[00:37:31] Journal

[00:37:31] okay

[00:37:32] in an op-ed

[00:37:33] author James

[00:37:34] Wilson

[00:37:34] fact-checks

[00:37:35] an Associated

[00:37:36] Press article

[00:37:37] on Halloween

[00:37:38] the article

[00:37:39] states that

[00:37:40] jack-o'-lanterns

[00:37:41] were first

[00:37:41] made from

[00:37:42] turnips and

[00:37:42] beets

[00:37:43] as we've

[00:37:43] learned

[00:37:43] that seems

[00:37:44] to be

[00:37:44] the agreed

[00:37:45] upon history

[00:37:45] but not

[00:37:46] so

[00:37:46] says Mr.

[00:37:48] Wilson

[00:37:48] in fact

[00:37:49] a jack-o'-lantern

[00:37:50] was the term

[00:37:51] for quote

[00:37:52] wooden cages

[00:37:53] suspended

[00:37:54] from trees

[00:37:54] where prisoners

[00:37:56] were set afire

[00:37:57] and so

[00:37:57] sacrificed

[00:37:58] oh wow

[00:37:59] that's

[00:38:00] scarier

[00:38:00] for sure

[00:38:01] and not true

[00:38:02] I don't think

[00:38:03] I looked it up

[00:38:03] so this is a guy

[00:38:04] who wrote an article

[00:38:05] saying

[00:38:06] you're not true

[00:38:07] this is true

[00:38:08] even though

[00:38:09] it was

[00:38:10] he's the only one

[00:38:11] like he's the least

[00:38:12] true

[00:38:12] yet he's claiming

[00:38:14] that everyone else

[00:38:15] is wrong

[00:38:15] I mean

[00:38:16] I dug around

[00:38:17] for a while

[00:38:18] and I couldn't

[00:38:19] find any

[00:38:19] corroborating stories

[00:38:20] or facts

[00:38:21] to support this

[00:38:21] claim

[00:38:22] I did find

[00:38:23] elsewhere

[00:38:23] in the article

[00:38:24] where Mr.

[00:38:25] Wilson claims

[00:38:25] quote

[00:38:26] pagan Halloween

[00:38:27] is nothing

[00:38:28] but a variant

[00:38:28] of the Old Testament

[00:38:29] ball worship

[00:38:31] B-A-A-L

[00:38:32] not B-A-L-L

[00:38:34] yeah

[00:38:34] practiced by

[00:38:35] Ahab and Jezebel

[00:38:37] now reincarnated

[00:38:39] in political leaders

[00:38:40] like Hillary Clinton

[00:38:41] and Barack Obama

[00:38:42] who make a religious crusade

[00:38:43] he says their words

[00:38:45] not mine

[00:38:45] of the right

[00:38:46] to sacrifice

[00:38:47] by aborting babies

[00:38:48] wait

[00:38:49] what year

[00:38:49] was this written

[00:38:50] I didn't check

[00:38:51] the year

[00:38:52] but for some reason

[00:38:52] I assumed

[00:38:53] it was gonna be

[00:38:53] like the 70s

[00:38:54] or 80s

[00:38:54] but now

[00:38:55] this language

[00:38:55] is telling me

[00:38:56] this was in the last

[00:38:57] couple years

[00:38:57] yeah yeah

[00:38:58] go ahead

[00:38:59] I was

[00:38:59] I think he has

[00:39:00] a specific

[00:39:01] point of view

[00:39:02] okay it sounds

[00:39:03] like it

[00:39:03] yeah he's revealing

[00:39:04] like

[00:39:04] it's interesting

[00:39:06] thug beats

[00:39:06] and turnips

[00:39:07] this guy's

[00:39:08] got an onion

[00:39:09] he's revealing

[00:39:10] new layers

[00:39:10] from

[00:39:11] with each moment

[00:39:12] I do know

[00:39:13] who Ball is

[00:39:14] though

[00:39:14] from the

[00:39:15] let's get

[00:39:15] haunted episode

[00:39:16] on Balenciaga

[00:39:17] talks about

[00:39:18] Ball

[00:39:19] from all the

[00:39:19] Balenciaga

[00:39:20] conspiracy theory

[00:39:21] stuff

[00:39:21] James Wilson

[00:39:22] is probably

[00:39:23] big into

[00:39:24] the

[00:39:24] Balenciaga

[00:39:25] conspiracy

[00:39:25] theories

[00:39:26] he says

[00:39:27] quote

[00:39:27] as Christians

[00:39:28] have grown

[00:39:28] increasingly

[00:39:29] lax about

[00:39:30] our call

[00:39:30] to constant

[00:39:31] worship

[00:39:31] of the

[00:39:32] god

[00:39:32] who

[00:39:32] came

[00:39:32] in

[00:39:33] flesh

[00:39:33] the

[00:39:33] pagans

[00:39:34] have simply

[00:39:34] reclaimed

[00:39:35] what was

[00:39:35] once

[00:39:35] their own

[00:39:36] most of us

[00:39:37] don't kill

[00:39:37] anyone

[00:39:38] but we

[00:39:38] certainly

[00:39:38] find an

[00:39:39] excuse

[00:39:39] in Halloween

[00:39:40] to justify

[00:39:40] raw lust

[00:39:42] French maids

[00:39:43] witches

[00:39:44] and vampires

[00:39:44] in lingerie

[00:39:45] what that has

[00:39:46] to do

[00:39:47] with kids

[00:39:47] and candy

[00:39:48] is beyond

[00:39:48] me

[00:39:49] but I

[00:39:49] do get

[00:39:50] the metaphysical

[00:39:51] tie into

[00:39:51] ballist

[00:39:52] sacred

[00:39:52] prostitution

[00:39:54] if that's

[00:39:55] what floats

[00:39:55] your boat

[00:39:56] and you know

[00:39:56] I gotta say

[00:39:57] I kind of

[00:39:59] for a different

[00:39:59] reason

[00:40:00] agree

[00:40:01] with Mr.

[00:40:02] Wilson

[00:40:02] I really

[00:40:03] don't like

[00:40:04] the adult

[00:40:05] sexy version

[00:40:06] of Halloween

[00:40:07] you know

[00:40:08] no shame

[00:40:09] to people

[00:40:10] who choose

[00:40:11] to celebrate

[00:40:12] Halloween

[00:40:12] that way

[00:40:12] but to me

[00:40:13] the Halloween

[00:40:14] spirit

[00:40:14] is a little

[00:40:15] bit like

[00:40:15] Christmas

[00:40:16] where

[00:40:16] you have

[00:40:17] to approach

[00:40:18] it from

[00:40:19] a little

[00:40:19] bit of

[00:40:19] that child

[00:40:20] like

[00:40:20] place

[00:40:21] where you

[00:40:21] can let

[00:40:22] a little

[00:40:22] weirdness

[00:40:22] and mystery

[00:40:23] in

[00:40:24] like

[00:40:24] drinking

[00:40:25] and hooking

[00:40:25] up is all

[00:40:26] well and good

[00:40:26] but I don't know

[00:40:27] it's more of a

[00:40:28] 4th of July

[00:40:29] thing to me

[00:40:30] like

[00:40:30] or Easter

[00:40:31] if you really

[00:40:32] want to upset

[00:40:33] people

[00:40:33] put on your

[00:40:34] put on your

[00:40:35] French made

[00:40:36] raw lust

[00:40:37] costume

[00:40:37] on Easter

[00:40:38] but in any

[00:40:39] case

[00:40:40] if there is

[00:40:40] any truth

[00:40:41] to this

[00:40:41] alternate

[00:40:41] history

[00:40:42] of jack-o-lanterns

[00:40:43] as places

[00:40:43] where people

[00:40:44] were burned

[00:40:45] alive in cages

[00:40:46] let me know

[00:40:47] I mean

[00:40:48] it's a cool

[00:40:48] origin story

[00:40:49] it's up there

[00:40:49] with the real

[00:40:50] origin story

[00:40:51] I mean

[00:40:51] it's not a

[00:40:52] bad idea

[00:40:53] I mean

[00:40:53] burning people

[00:40:54] alive in cages

[00:40:54] is a bad idea

[00:40:56] every time

[00:40:56] but I'm saying

[00:40:57] it's not a bad idea

[00:40:58] Ed and I actually

[00:40:59] had a third co-host

[00:41:00] at the beginning

[00:41:00] of this show

[00:41:01] and we burned him

[00:41:01] alive in a cage

[00:41:02] and we regret it

[00:41:03] to this day

[00:41:03] I don't regret how much

[00:41:04] we got for that cage

[00:41:05] after

[00:41:05] we didn't say

[00:41:06] we hosed it down

[00:41:07] and we sold it

[00:41:07] for pretty good

[00:41:08] almost what we

[00:41:08] bought it for

[00:41:10] but no genuinely

[00:41:11] part of the reason

[00:41:12] I bring it up

[00:41:12] is because

[00:41:13] I couldn't find

[00:41:14] anything on it

[00:41:14] but it feels

[00:41:15] specific enough

[00:41:16] that I feel like

[00:41:17] it must have come

[00:41:18] from somewhere

[00:41:18] so if anyone

[00:41:19] knows please

[00:41:20] let us know

[00:41:21] let me know

[00:41:21] what's the guy's

[00:41:22] name James Wilson

[00:41:23] James Wilson

[00:41:23] so Mr. Wilson

[00:41:25] who had a lot to say

[00:41:26] about Dennis the Menace

[00:41:27] next door

[00:41:28] as well

[00:41:29] do you think

[00:41:30] he's the person

[00:41:30] that wrote

[00:41:31] that review

[00:41:32] of our show

[00:41:33] that says

[00:41:33] that we were

[00:41:34] ballist sympathizers

[00:41:36] yeah I remember that

[00:41:37] no there was

[00:41:38] well there was

[00:41:38] one guy

[00:41:39] who was mad

[00:41:40] that we were

[00:41:40] too Christian

[00:41:41] yeah but that

[00:41:42] all I'm saying is

[00:41:43] some of the language

[00:41:44] in this person's op-ed

[00:41:45] was pretty fucking

[00:41:47] similar to some

[00:41:48] of the languages

[00:41:49] in that unhinged

[00:41:50] review we were given

[00:41:51] maybe they read

[00:41:51] the same newsletters

[00:41:52] I guess so

[00:41:53] tucked into the

[00:41:54] windshield wipers

[00:41:55] of their cars

[00:41:57] so the other element

[00:41:58] to the jack-o'-lantern

[00:41:59] story I wanted to

[00:42:00] touch on here

[00:42:01] there's another article

[00:42:02] I read on

[00:42:03] irishmyths.com

[00:42:05] that ties the

[00:42:06] history of jack-o'-lanterns

[00:42:08] even deeper

[00:42:08] into Irish

[00:42:09] history and culture

[00:42:10] and here I'm quoting

[00:42:12] historian

[00:42:13] Peter Beresford Ellis

[00:42:15] the author of

[00:42:16] A Dictionary of

[00:42:17] Irish Mythology

[00:42:18] and the Celtic Empire

[00:42:19] he says quote

[00:42:20] the ancient Irish

[00:42:21] revered the human head

[00:42:23] as indeed did all

[00:42:25] ancient Celtic societies

[00:42:26] it was in the head

[00:42:28] and not the heart

[00:42:29] that they seemed to

[00:42:30] locate the souls

[00:42:31] of men and women

[00:42:32] irishmyths.com

[00:42:33] tells us that

[00:42:34] quote

[00:42:34] in Celtic enclaves

[00:42:36] of northern Europe

[00:42:37] e.g. Ireland

[00:42:38] Scotland

[00:42:38] Wales

[00:42:38] the Isle of Man

[00:42:39] Cornwall

[00:42:40] Brittany

[00:42:41] the carving of

[00:42:42] human faces

[00:42:43] into round fruits

[00:42:44] and vegetables

[00:42:44] has been going on

[00:42:45] for thousands of years

[00:42:46] it's a tradition

[00:42:47] that likely evolved

[00:42:48] from the Celtic custom

[00:42:50] of head veneration

[00:42:51] okay what

[00:42:52] wherein the severed

[00:42:53] heads of one enemies

[00:42:55] were taken as war trophies

[00:42:56] for example

[00:42:57] okay like when they put

[00:42:58] them on spikes and stuff

[00:42:59] at the end of the street

[00:43:00] well get this

[00:43:01] for example

[00:43:01] there's the story

[00:43:02] of Ulster hero

[00:43:04] Cuchelaine

[00:43:05] the Hound of Culean

[00:43:06] who returned

[00:43:07] from his first ever battle

[00:43:09] with three heads

[00:43:10] hanging from his chariot

[00:43:11] as well as

[00:43:12] nine heads

[00:43:13] in one hand

[00:43:14] and ten in the other

[00:43:15] so this guy had huge hands

[00:43:17] yeah or like

[00:43:18] the hair

[00:43:18] or maybe the

[00:43:19] each head

[00:43:20] had long hair

[00:43:21] and then he can grab

[00:43:22] the hair

[00:43:22] but think about

[00:43:23] if you're holding

[00:43:24] garbage bags

[00:43:25] by you know

[00:43:26] yeah

[00:43:27] by a little bit

[00:43:28] ten is a lot

[00:43:29] in each hand

[00:43:29] even if you're holding

[00:43:30] just the strings

[00:43:31] yeah

[00:43:32] well

[00:43:34] who's driving

[00:43:35] the chariot

[00:43:36] like he's got

[00:43:36] both hands

[00:43:38] are full of heads

[00:43:38] I assume

[00:43:39] if he has

[00:43:39] nine heads

[00:43:40] in one hand

[00:43:41] and ten

[00:43:41] in the other

[00:43:41] he also probably

[00:43:42] has a slave

[00:43:43] oh yeah

[00:43:44] or a couple

[00:43:45] and also

[00:43:46] fuck

[00:43:47] even if I'm not

[00:43:48] his slave

[00:43:48] he's like

[00:43:48] grab that for me

[00:43:49] I'd be like

[00:43:50] well did those

[00:43:51] nine people

[00:43:51] say no

[00:43:52] so yeah

[00:43:53] I'll do it

[00:43:53] whatever you need

[00:43:53] pal

[00:43:54] seems like

[00:43:54] you're in the

[00:43:55] business of

[00:43:56] taking heads

[00:43:57] so these nine

[00:43:57] heads

[00:43:58] in one

[00:43:58] ten

[00:43:58] in the other

[00:43:59] these he

[00:43:59] brandished

[00:44:00] at the hosts

[00:44:00] in token

[00:44:01] of his valor

[00:44:02] and prowess

[00:44:03] meanwhile

[00:44:04] in a story

[00:44:05] called

[00:44:05] the destruction

[00:44:06] of Daderga's

[00:44:08] hostel

[00:44:08] the warrior

[00:44:09] canal

[00:44:10] pours water

[00:44:11] into the mouth

[00:44:12] of the high

[00:44:13] king of Ireland

[00:44:14] Conair Moor's

[00:44:15] severed head

[00:44:16] and the head

[00:44:17] thanks him

[00:44:18] oh

[00:44:18] polite head

[00:44:19] very polite

[00:44:20] yeah

[00:44:21] very polite

[00:44:22] severed head

[00:44:23] it's like eight heads

[00:44:23] in a duffel bag

[00:44:24] especially I feel like

[00:44:25] and not to generalize

[00:44:26] I don't feel like

[00:44:27] the Irish are usually

[00:44:28] noted for being

[00:44:29] so polite

[00:44:30] I can't

[00:44:30] look they like to

[00:44:31] have a laugh

[00:44:32] okay that might

[00:44:32] come off as gruff

[00:44:33] I don't know

[00:44:34] I feel like anyone

[00:44:34] who had their head

[00:44:35] cut off

[00:44:36] you have to be

[00:44:37] exceedingly polite

[00:44:38] I'm a very polite

[00:44:39] person generally

[00:44:40] I think

[00:44:40] and if someone

[00:44:41] chopped off my head

[00:44:42] and poured water

[00:44:42] in my throat

[00:44:43] I don't know

[00:44:43] that I'd thank them

[00:44:44] yeah but you'd

[00:44:45] probably apologize

[00:44:46] you'd be like

[00:44:47] sorry I'm a heavy head

[00:44:48] oh my god

[00:44:49] I'm so sorry

[00:44:49] I'm so thirsty

[00:44:50] can I have a little

[00:44:51] warm so sorry

[00:44:52] yeah

[00:44:52] quote ancient

[00:44:53] historians

[00:44:54] Livy and Deodorus

[00:44:55] Siculus

[00:44:56] both recount

[00:44:57] instances of

[00:44:57] Celtic warriors

[00:44:58] hanging the severed

[00:44:59] heads of their

[00:44:59] slain foes

[00:45:00] from the necks

[00:45:01] of their horses

[00:45:02] Siculus

[00:45:03] further notes

[00:45:03] that especially

[00:45:04] distinguished foes

[00:45:05] were given the royal

[00:45:06] treatment

[00:45:06] their heads

[00:45:07] were embalmed

[00:45:08] in cedar oil

[00:45:09] and displayed

[00:45:10] with pride

[00:45:10] to visitors

[00:45:11] this is my favorite

[00:45:13] fact from this

[00:45:14] section

[00:45:14] this practice

[00:45:15] is also reflected

[00:45:17] in the ancient

[00:45:18] Irish tradition

[00:45:19] of creating

[00:45:19] brain balls

[00:45:21] wherein the brains

[00:45:22] of enemies

[00:45:23] were hardened

[00:45:23] with lime

[00:45:24] and used as

[00:45:25] slingshot

[00:45:26] projectiles

[00:45:27] the most famous

[00:45:28] brain ball

[00:45:29] was made by

[00:45:30] konal kernak

[00:45:31] from the brain

[00:45:32] of leinster king

[00:45:34] mezgrega

[00:45:35] this brain ball

[00:45:36] was stolen

[00:45:37] by the

[00:45:37] conact warrior

[00:45:38] ket mak magach

[00:45:40] there's no fucking

[00:45:42] way

[00:45:42] used to kill

[00:45:44] konkobar

[00:45:45] maknessa

[00:45:46] all of which

[00:45:47] sounds fake

[00:45:47] and like I'm

[00:45:48] making it up

[00:45:48] on the spot

[00:45:49] but is

[00:45:50] historical fact

[00:45:51] so

[00:45:51] dude we're gonna

[00:45:52] get so many

[00:45:53] fucking

[00:45:53] brain balls

[00:45:54] shot at us

[00:45:55] from fucking

[00:45:56] Dennis the Menace

[00:45:57] style slingshots

[00:45:58] because Irish people

[00:45:59] are gonna be like

[00:45:59] there wasn't one

[00:46:00] correct pronunciation

[00:46:01] in that whole

[00:46:02] John Beguets

[00:46:04] Susan

[00:46:04] you know what

[00:46:04] I did pronounce

[00:46:05] correctly though

[00:46:05] brain balls

[00:46:06] and let's not

[00:46:07] overlook the fact

[00:46:08] that those are

[00:46:09] the coolest

[00:46:09] weapons I've ever

[00:46:10] heard of

[00:46:11] I just think

[00:46:11] it's you know

[00:46:12] these are people

[00:46:13] who gave birth

[00:46:14] to stingy

[00:46:15] to stingy jack

[00:46:17] so these are like

[00:46:18] use every part

[00:46:18] of the buffalo

[00:46:19] people maybe

[00:46:20] I guess

[00:46:20] but how cool

[00:46:21] to make basically

[00:46:22] like slingshot

[00:46:24] ammunition

[00:46:25] from the brains

[00:46:26] of your enemies

[00:46:27] I just feel like

[00:46:28] leave the heads

[00:46:29] where you found

[00:46:30] them

[00:46:30] no

[00:46:30] take them

[00:46:31] I say take them

[00:46:32] do you know what

[00:46:33] there's projectiles

[00:46:34] under all of our

[00:46:35] fucking feet

[00:46:36] any guy who's ever

[00:46:36] plowed a field

[00:46:37] and is like

[00:46:38] another rock

[00:46:38] another rock

[00:46:39] another rock

[00:46:39] brain balls

[00:46:40] are living in

[00:46:41] the fucking ground

[00:46:41] you don't gotta go

[00:46:43] looking for brain balls

[00:46:44] well you don't

[00:46:44] look for brain balls

[00:46:45] you make them

[00:46:46] did you think

[00:46:48] that's why I'm not

[00:46:48] an organ donor

[00:46:49] people back that needed

[00:46:49] things to do

[00:46:50] that's why I'm not

[00:46:51] an organ donor

[00:46:51] why because someone's

[00:46:52] gonna make marbles

[00:46:53] out of your guts

[00:46:54] no my brain

[00:46:55] out of your brain

[00:46:56] anyway all this

[00:46:57] came to a head

[00:46:58] sorry during the

[00:46:59] celtic festival

[00:46:59] of Samhain

[00:47:00] when it was believed

[00:47:01] that souls from

[00:47:02] the other world

[00:47:02] were able to cross

[00:47:03] over to the land

[00:47:04] of the living

[00:47:04] looking for their

[00:47:05] brain balls

[00:47:06] they're stolen

[00:47:06] brain balls

[00:47:07] filled their head

[00:47:07] with a rattling

[00:47:08] with brain balls

[00:47:09] you made a ball

[00:47:10] out of my memories

[00:47:10] man they must have

[00:47:11] been fun to play

[00:47:12] hungry hungry hippos

[00:47:13] with

[00:47:13] armed with a plethora

[00:47:16] of root vegetables

[00:47:17] from the recent harvest

[00:47:18] as Samhain marked

[00:47:19] the end of one

[00:47:20] pastoral year

[00:47:21] the beginning of the

[00:47:22] next

[00:47:22] ancient peoples

[00:47:23] carved frightening

[00:47:24] faces in an effort

[00:47:25] to ward off

[00:47:26] restless souls

[00:47:27] and since the 1800s

[00:47:29] there has been

[00:47:30] a continued

[00:47:30] scattered evolution

[00:47:32] of the jack-o'-lantern

[00:47:33] term

[00:47:33] in 1837

[00:47:35] the limerick

[00:47:37] chronicle

[00:47:37] which is

[00:47:38] a real

[00:47:39] leprechaun ass

[00:47:40] name for a newspaper

[00:47:41] sure

[00:47:42] refers to a local

[00:47:43] pub holding

[00:47:44] a carved

[00:47:44] gourd competition

[00:47:46] and presenting

[00:47:46] a prize

[00:47:47] to the best

[00:47:48] crown of

[00:47:48] jack-o'-lantern

[00:47:49] the term

[00:47:50] mclantern

[00:47:51] also appears

[00:47:51] in an 1841

[00:47:52] publication

[00:47:53] of the same

[00:47:54] paper

[00:47:55] so that was

[00:47:55] a precursor

[00:47:56] to

[00:47:57] or I guess

[00:47:58] an offshoot

[00:47:59] of the jack-o'-lantern

[00:48:00] they could have

[00:48:00] been jack-o'-lanterns

[00:48:02] if that had caught on

[00:48:03] according to the

[00:48:04] irish times

[00:48:05] the first definitive

[00:48:05] reference to a

[00:48:06] pumpkin jack-o'-lantern

[00:48:07] carved in celebration

[00:48:09] of halloween

[00:48:09] occurred in 1886

[00:48:11] when a canadian

[00:48:12] newspaper

[00:48:13] the daily news

[00:48:14] which is a much

[00:48:14] more normal name

[00:48:15] for a newspaper

[00:48:16] than the

[00:48:17] limerick chronicle

[00:48:18] reported the

[00:48:19] following

[00:48:20] quote

[00:48:20] the old time

[00:48:21] custom of

[00:48:22] keeping up

[00:48:22] halloween

[00:48:23] was not

[00:48:23] forgotten

[00:48:24] last night

[00:48:24] by the

[00:48:25] youngsters

[00:48:25] of the

[00:48:25] city

[00:48:26] there was

[00:48:26] a great

[00:48:27] sacrifice

[00:48:27] of pumpkins

[00:48:28] from which

[00:48:29] to make

[00:48:29] transparent

[00:48:29] heads

[00:48:30] and face

[00:48:31] lighted up

[00:48:32] by the

[00:48:32] unfailing

[00:48:33] two inches

[00:48:33] of tallow

[00:48:34] candle

[00:48:34] however

[00:48:35] it should

[00:48:36] be noted

[00:48:36] that the

[00:48:37] first image

[00:48:38] of a

[00:48:38] pumpkin

[00:48:39] jack-o'-lantern

[00:48:39] appeared

[00:48:40] nearly two

[00:48:40] decades

[00:48:41] prior to this

[00:48:42] in the

[00:48:43] November

[00:48:43] 23rd

[00:48:44] 1867

[00:48:45] issue of

[00:48:45] harper's

[00:48:46] weekly

[00:48:46] it was

[00:48:47] published

[00:48:47] alongside

[00:48:48] an article

[00:48:49] titled

[00:48:49] a pumpkin

[00:48:50] effigy

[00:48:50] but

[00:48:51] and this

[00:48:52] is an

[00:48:52] important

[00:48:52] but

[00:48:52] the article

[00:48:53] did not

[00:48:54] refer to

[00:48:54] the carved

[00:48:55] gourd

[00:48:55] as a

[00:48:56] jack-o'-lantern

[00:48:57] or a

[00:48:57] jack-mick

[00:48:58] lantern

[00:48:58] nor did

[00:48:59] it reference

[00:49:00] halloween

[00:49:01] and the image

[00:49:02] itself

[00:49:02] is pretty

[00:49:03] creepy

[00:49:04] almost creepier

[00:49:05] for the fact

[00:49:06] that it

[00:49:06] doesn't

[00:49:07] reference

[00:49:07] halloween

[00:49:08] look at

[00:49:09] this ed

[00:49:09] okay i'm

[00:49:10] clicking

[00:49:10] i'm

[00:49:11] opening

[00:49:11] now if

[00:49:12] a group

[00:49:13] of children

[00:49:13] is doing

[00:49:14] this on

[00:49:14] halloween

[00:49:15] i'd say

[00:49:16] okay that's

[00:49:17] cute but

[00:49:18] it makes

[00:49:18] sense

[00:49:18] i still

[00:49:19] don't have

[00:49:20] my glasses

[00:49:20] from the

[00:49:21] accident and

[00:49:22] they're getting

[00:49:22] made everything

[00:49:23] takes forever

[00:49:23] i guess

[00:49:24] um is one

[00:49:25] kid holding

[00:49:26] a head

[00:49:26] no it's a

[00:49:27] hat okay now

[00:49:28] that it's

[00:49:28] closer to my

[00:49:28] face so

[00:49:29] are they is

[00:49:30] it just a

[00:49:30] jack-o'-lantern

[00:49:31] this is a

[00:49:31] traditional

[00:49:32] jack-o'-lantern

[00:49:32] like triangle

[00:49:33] eyes triangle

[00:49:34] nose triangle

[00:49:34] everything but

[00:49:35] i just don't

[00:49:36] know if it's

[00:49:36] like on a

[00:49:36] stump or on

[00:49:37] a kid

[00:49:38] like just

[00:49:38] tell me what

[00:49:38] the fuck

[00:49:39] they're doing

[00:49:39] here i

[00:49:39] just i

[00:49:40] can't

[00:49:40] well it's

[00:49:41] it's so

[00:49:42] iconically

[00:49:42] halloween

[00:49:43] like if

[00:49:43] someone just

[00:49:44] showed me

[00:49:44] this with

[00:49:45] my glasses

[00:49:45] on and

[00:49:46] they said

[00:49:46] what do you

[00:49:46] think the

[00:49:47] title of

[00:49:47] this etching

[00:49:48] is i would

[00:49:49] say halloween

[00:49:50] well yeah it's

[00:49:51] we're looking at

[00:49:51] three kids

[00:49:52] surrounding a

[00:49:53] stump with a

[00:49:54] very evil

[00:49:54] looking halloween

[00:49:55] pumpkin on

[00:49:56] it and

[00:49:56] another kid

[00:49:57] clutching his

[00:49:58] sister or

[00:49:59] mother uh

[00:50:00] and looking on

[00:50:01] at the pumpkin

[00:50:02] in fear yeah

[00:50:03] it's a gorgeous

[00:50:04] actually gorgeous

[00:50:04] it is but my

[00:50:06] point is it's

[00:50:07] very frightening

[00:50:08] to have nothing

[00:50:09] to do with

[00:50:09] halloween

[00:50:10] was it titled

[00:50:11] the war is

[00:50:11] over

[00:50:12] the great

[00:50:13] pumpkin war

[00:50:14] no civil war

[00:50:15] would have

[00:50:15] ended what a

[00:50:15] year earlier

[00:50:16] two years

[00:50:16] earlier it's

[00:50:17] an effigy

[00:50:18] maybe that's

[00:50:19] supposed to be

[00:50:19] jefferson davis

[00:50:20] or something

[00:50:20] i don't know

[00:50:21] what the fuck

[00:50:21] these kids are

[00:50:22] doing carving

[00:50:22] that nightmarish

[00:50:23] face for fun

[00:50:24] right around

[00:50:25] thanksgiving

[00:50:25] but it could

[00:50:26] not be a

[00:50:28] more traditional

[00:50:29] jack-o'-lantern

[00:50:30] though which is

[00:50:30] what's so

[00:50:30] shocking to me

[00:50:31] yeah crazy

[00:50:32] i encourage you

[00:50:33] to go look at

[00:50:34] the image again

[00:50:34] in our show

[00:50:35] notes everything

[00:50:36] we just said

[00:50:36] will make a lot

[00:50:37] more sense

[00:50:37] looking at it

[00:50:38] and then finally

[00:50:40] and interestingly

[00:50:40] i always thought

[00:50:42] that the legend

[00:50:42] of sleepy hollow

[00:50:43] and the headless

[00:50:44] horseman must

[00:50:45] have had something

[00:50:46] to do with why

[00:50:47] jack-o'-lanterns got

[00:50:48] so popular in the

[00:50:49] united states in

[00:50:50] halloween but when

[00:50:51] i went back to

[00:50:51] check the original

[00:50:52] story which was

[00:50:53] published in 1820

[00:50:54] it only mentions a

[00:50:56] shattered pumpkin

[00:50:57] discovered next to

[00:50:58] ichabod crane's

[00:50:59] hat the morning

[00:51:00] after his encounter

[00:51:01] with the horseman

[00:51:02] the story never

[00:51:03] actually references

[00:51:04] jack-o'-lanterns or

[00:51:05] halloween

[00:51:06] creative license

[00:51:07] so well i assume

[00:51:08] poetic that must

[00:51:09] be an invention

[00:51:10] of disney with

[00:51:11] the famous cartoon

[00:51:12] and maybe that's

[00:51:13] the first time that

[00:51:14] he had a pumpkin

[00:51:15] head yeah i mean

[00:51:16] disney would is

[00:51:16] responsible for a

[00:51:17] lot of things that

[00:51:18] we now think is

[00:51:20] the thing yeah

[00:51:21] so yeah maybe

[00:51:22] it's a creepy it

[00:51:23] was i always assumed

[00:51:24] that there was more

[00:51:24] of a halloween

[00:51:25] legend element to

[00:51:27] that and there

[00:51:27] really wasn't

[00:51:28] there was a fall

[00:51:29] time gored pumpkin

[00:51:30] piece but not

[00:51:32] really uh inherent

[00:51:34] to the story in

[00:51:35] any way so i

[00:51:36] guess you're right

[00:51:37] yeah thanks disney

[00:51:38] i mean i don't

[00:51:39] have it i don't

[00:51:40] have it i don't

[00:51:41] know yeah i don't

[00:51:41] have it in front

[00:51:42] of me but like the

[00:51:42] whole thing about how

[00:51:43] lemmings follow each

[00:51:44] other off a cliff

[00:51:45] oh yeah disney

[00:51:46] invented that for the

[00:51:47] wild documentary

[00:51:49] thing yeah and it

[00:51:50] was like they had

[00:51:51] like lemmings on a

[00:51:52] lazy susan that was

[00:51:53] like hitting on a

[00:51:54] lazy susan i don't

[00:51:54] know if they really

[00:51:55] just threw those

[00:51:55] fucking things off a

[00:51:56] cliff but like that

[00:51:57] was an invention of

[00:51:59] that documentary which

[00:52:00] by it shouldn't be

[00:52:01] called a fucking

[00:52:01] documentary then yeah

[00:52:02] if you've manipulated

[00:52:03] it that much well

[00:52:04] that's every documentary

[00:52:05] though i mean

[00:52:06] almost every documentary

[00:52:07] well that's true that

[00:52:08] is manipulated to

[00:52:09] almost the to a

[00:52:11] herzogian extreme

[00:52:12] because that's

[00:52:12] because they're

[00:52:13] telling you like look

[00:52:14] at this thing we

[00:52:14] caught in nature i'm

[00:52:15] like you really

[00:52:16] fucking did it yeah

[00:52:17] i bet whatever just

[00:52:18] like cigarette smoking

[00:52:20] pa was chucking those

[00:52:23] lemmings off the cliff

[00:52:23] probably got promoted

[00:52:25] yeah that was that was

[00:52:26] jeffrey katzenberg

[00:52:28] jeffrey katzenberg

[00:52:29] which exec or got

[00:52:31] his start in the

[00:52:31] industry as the guy

[00:52:32] who threw the

[00:52:33] lemmings off the cliff

[00:52:34] in that disney

[00:52:35] documentary god that

[00:52:36] would with my

[00:52:37] no well no with my

[00:52:38] luck that would be like

[00:52:39] the million dollar

[00:52:39] question on who wants

[00:52:40] to be a millionaire

[00:52:41] yeah and that's like

[00:52:42] phone a friend you'll

[00:52:43] be like i don't fucking

[00:52:44] know and give me like

[00:52:45] some asshole answer and

[00:52:46] i'll be like i don't

[00:52:46] know yeah dee jeffrey

[00:52:47] katzenberg and then

[00:52:48] regis philman is he still

[00:52:50] with us regis philman yeah

[00:52:52] no all right god bless

[00:52:54] i think regis has passed

[00:52:56] regis would say i'm

[00:52:57] sorry yeah did you know

[00:52:59] the first guy to win a

[00:52:59] million dollars on the

[00:53:00] american who wants to be

[00:53:01] millionaires from

[00:53:02] connecticut i did not

[00:53:03] but i think i watched

[00:53:04] it yeah he called his

[00:53:05] dad remember because

[00:53:06] he still had like two

[00:53:07] lifelines left and he

[00:53:09] was like i want to

[00:53:09] phone a friend and

[00:53:11] regis was like all

[00:53:12] right who do you want

[00:53:12] to call and he's

[00:53:13] like i want to call my

[00:53:14] dad he's like call

[00:53:15] your dad and then he

[00:53:16] did he's like hey

[00:53:16] dad i don't need any

[00:53:17] help i just want to

[00:53:18] tell you i'm gonna win

[00:53:18] a million dollars oh

[00:53:19] right yeah it was

[00:53:20] like such a baller move

[00:53:21] yeah fun times man

[00:53:23] what happened to the

[00:53:24] early 2000s they're

[00:53:26] gone they died

[00:53:28] yeah they went into a

[00:53:30] quagmire of a war in

[00:53:31] the middle east well

[00:53:32] unfortunately for this

[00:53:33] show unlike the

[00:53:34] quagmire in the middle

[00:53:35] east jack-o-lanterns

[00:53:36] don't really cause much

[00:53:37] death and destruction in

[00:53:38] real life if anything

[00:53:40] they've become symbols of

[00:53:41] welcome on halloween

[00:53:43] night if the jack-o-lantern

[00:53:44] is out and lit it usually

[00:53:45] means the house is open

[00:53:46] for business and you can

[00:53:47] get that candy they're

[00:53:49] actually more dangerous

[00:53:50] in their original form

[00:53:52] the pumpkin the faceless

[00:53:54] boring bland pumpkin and

[00:53:55] why do i say that because

[00:53:57] in all of my jack-o-lantern

[00:53:58] research the most dangerous

[00:54:00] tales came from pumpkin

[00:54:01] patches pre-carving that's

[00:54:04] crazy i in my mind a

[00:54:05] pumpkin patch is where

[00:54:06] you go to like meet a

[00:54:07] wholesome partner well you

[00:54:09] can meet a wholesome

[00:54:10] partner at a pumpkin

[00:54:11] patch but you can also

[00:54:12] almost die a lot of

[00:54:14] different ways that's also

[00:54:15] dating you're just

[00:54:16] describing dating so we're

[00:54:17] both describing dating it's

[00:54:18] true ed have you ever

[00:54:20] heard of pumpkin chunkin

[00:54:22] pumpkin chunkin usually

[00:54:24] spelled in this case as p-u-n-k-i-n

[00:54:27] so pumpkin chunkin pumpkin

[00:54:29] chunkin what is that a

[00:54:30] position yeah it's something

[00:54:33] that happens after the end

[00:54:34] of a good date you go

[00:54:35] pumpkin chunkin no it's an

[00:54:37] event that takes place i

[00:54:38] think all over the country

[00:54:40] but is most famous for an

[00:54:41] event in delaware where

[00:54:42] people and i'm taking this

[00:54:44] from an official

[00:54:45] description quote launch

[00:54:46] pumpkins as far as they can

[00:54:48] using enormous hand-built

[00:54:50] machines catapults air

[00:54:52] cannons trebuchets and more i

[00:54:54] don't think you need that n in

[00:54:56] chunkin then it could just be

[00:54:57] pumpkin chuckin or punkin

[00:54:59] chuckin i don't know how it

[00:55:00] became stylized this way it's

[00:55:02] a fucking nightmare well it

[00:55:04] the event combines strength

[00:55:06] engineering skills and pure

[00:55:07] lunacy and has the kind of

[00:55:09] dedicated following usually

[00:55:10] reserved for more moneyed

[00:55:12] sports the event and

[00:55:14] supposedly it started this way

[00:55:15] there's a lot of local

[00:55:16] legends about this but the

[00:55:18] event supposedly started with

[00:55:19] four delaware guys trying to

[00:55:21] one-up each other in a

[00:55:22] blacksmith shop 29 years ago

[00:55:24] i love it that's how so many

[00:55:25] things like 24 hours of lemons

[00:55:27] or this or the movie

[00:55:29] basketball what's 24 hours of

[00:55:31] lemons you've heard of 24

[00:55:33] hours of lemans the race yeah

[00:55:34] it's like that but you have to

[00:55:36] do it with cars that are under

[00:55:37] a thousand dollars

[00:55:38] oh and it was just like

[00:55:39] that's fun some regular dude

[00:55:41] started it but now there's like

[00:55:42] national chapters and it's all

[00:55:44] over the country and yeah it's

[00:55:46] it's a pretty big deal and it's

[00:55:47] got crazy rules right but i'm

[00:55:49] saying like that this thing

[00:55:50] you're talking about the movie

[00:55:51] basketball the red bull thing

[00:55:53] the red bull wagon thing where

[00:55:55] they're like yeah yeah anything

[00:55:56] that just kind of started as

[00:55:57] something stupid and then turns

[00:55:58] into this like oh my god this

[00:55:59] podcast yes exactly i really

[00:56:02] want to go to it it can't be

[00:56:03] good for the environment in

[00:56:04] alaska there's like this car

[00:56:06] tossing event where like you

[00:56:09] you wait at the bottom of what

[00:56:10] is like a mountain basically and

[00:56:12] at the top they just attach cars

[00:56:16] to i don't know some sort of

[00:56:18] winch system that just launched the

[00:56:21] car off a cliff well that's a

[00:56:23] trebuchet right the winch system

[00:56:25] that like yeah but it's not they

[00:56:26] don't put it into a like medieval

[00:56:28] trebuchet yeah i'm just saying it's

[00:56:30] more they just yeah honestly though i

[00:56:31] think they actually just fucking

[00:56:32] hold the gas pedal down and they

[00:56:34] just uh put a fucking rope keeping

[00:56:36] the keeping the steering wheel

[00:56:38] straight but it's just people sit at

[00:56:42] mash amazing but they do that all

[00:56:45] day and i don't know who cleans it

[00:56:47] up and i don't know if it ever like

[00:56:48] hits people but we gotta go we gotta

[00:56:51] go that seems like a super fun very

[00:56:54] american thing to do if you run the

[00:56:56] car chucking event in alaska we'll

[00:56:58] help clean up if you get us tickets to

[00:57:00] go i don't think it costs anything oh

[00:57:02] okay well then we won't help clean up

[00:57:05] anything um so apparently these guys

[00:57:09] were trying to one-up each other and

[00:57:11] after anvil tossing proved too hard on

[00:57:14] their backs oh my god that's something

[00:57:16] you do once right no i it could not

[00:57:19] have taken very long to have proved too

[00:57:21] hard on their backs they turned to a

[00:57:23] lighter type of ammunition pumpkins

[00:57:25] riffing on their surroundings they

[00:57:27] challenged each other to build medieval

[00:57:29] style pumpkin tossing machines and to

[00:57:31] meet at a local field the weekend after

[00:57:33] halloween when pumpkins are free and

[00:57:36] plentiful when the day arrived three

[00:57:38] machines rolled up to the firing line

[00:57:40] quote they were built out of spare

[00:57:42] parts garage door springs twisted ropes

[00:57:44] whatever they felt would propel the

[00:57:46] pumpkin the farthest the longest throw

[00:57:48] that year was about 114 feet they

[00:57:51] vowed to do it again the next year and

[00:57:54] then the next and thus was born the

[00:57:55] annual world champion pumpkin chunkin

[00:57:57] or wcpc for short most of the years of

[00:58:01] the pumpkin chunkin event went off without

[00:58:03] a hitch but after a few accidents in the

[00:58:06] 2010s the future of the event was

[00:58:07] already on shaky ground before disaster

[00:58:10] finally really truly struck in 2016 so

[00:58:13] we can't go no this event's no longer

[00:58:15] with us no this event is no longer with

[00:58:17] us because a person is almost no longer

[00:58:20] with us i'm reading here from an article

[00:58:22] posted on delaware online.com quote

[00:58:25] delaware is world famous pumpkin chunkin

[00:58:27] back after a two-year hiatus prompted by

[00:58:30] an accident in lawsuit turned dangerous

[00:58:32] sunday afternoon when an air cannon firing a

[00:58:35] pumpkin broke apart injuring a man and

[00:58:37] woman according to delaware state police

[00:58:39] yeah the 39 year old woman who state

[00:58:41] police initially reported had died so so

[00:58:45] you know it was bad oh my god no one

[00:58:48] could have survived what we just saw yeah

[00:58:50] so send over a couple bags take your time

[00:58:52] boys is listed in critical condition at

[00:58:55] christiana hospital in stanton judges

[00:58:58] that already seen about 10 air cannons

[00:59:01] fire pumpkins more than 3 000 feet

[00:59:05] using compressed air when the trap door of

[00:59:08] the air cannon named pumpkin reaper tough

[00:59:11] name all things considered yeah flew off

[00:59:14] when it fired shortly before 2 40 p.m on

[00:59:17] sunday as people were running away from the

[00:59:20] cannon which sent large pieces of material

[00:59:22] into the air in all directions a person was

[00:59:25] struck in the head and face at the event

[00:59:27] site the woman lay motionless as paramedics

[00:59:30] and emergency responders rushed to her side

[00:59:32] paramedics were called to the scene where many

[00:59:35] spectators and participants stood in shock to

[00:59:37] offer the woman further treatment and she

[00:59:39] ended up being treated at the event grounds

[00:59:41] before she was taken to nanticoke memorial

[00:59:44] hospital

[00:59:46] carrie collius who had just gotten to

[00:59:48] pumpkin chunk and when the incident

[00:59:50] occurred saw the air cannon malfunction and

[00:59:53] the aftermath up close the cannon pumpkin reaper

[00:59:56] again you're asking for trouble here was

[00:59:58] registered a 21 year old will shell the grandson of

[01:00:02] dominic dafner who said saturday he and his

[01:00:04] grandsons were competing against each other in

[01:00:06] the event uh crazy enough i dug a little deeper on

[01:00:10] the victim here and she is actually a television

[01:00:13] producer oh wow named suzanne de kessian who was

[01:00:17] chronicling the 2016 world champion punk and

[01:00:19] chunk in for the science channel according to cnn her

[01:00:23] memory of the explosion is hazy she ran as a large metal

[01:00:26] plate flew toward where she and other tv crew members

[01:00:29] were standing for a split second she turned to see

[01:00:32] where the debris might land and that's when the

[01:00:34] plate struck her head oh i don't like that so i

[01:00:37] because there's one thing if it's a sudden death

[01:00:39] where it's like oh that's an interesting cannon

[01:00:41] oh yeah and it's another thing apparently we're

[01:00:43] like how far well i think it's just so crazy to me

[01:00:47] like people were probably you know there's probably a

[01:00:49] safety perimeter around these things so they're you

[01:00:52] know 100 feet away it blows up and you get

[01:00:55] enough of a chance to go oh fuck like you see it or

[01:00:58] maybe more realistically yeah i don't know i got nothing

[01:01:02] in the aftermath of the incident de kessian had to have part of her skull

[01:01:06] removed because her brain was swelling the show was ultimately scrapped

[01:01:10] although she says she would have preferred it came to fruition

[01:01:13] it's heartbreaking she says i was really looking forward to seeing what came

[01:01:18] from all the hard work i put in the day of the chunk i was working 15

[01:01:22] hour days and to not see the product after all that blood sweat and tears

[01:01:26] which very literal here i'm really bummed out about it but i understand

[01:01:32] this is a big world it's much bigger than me and i don't have any

[01:01:35] kind of right to say what people should or shouldn't do and this is a good

[01:01:38] point to bring out pierre like even if you're making faux documentary

[01:01:41] science channel i'm saying faux documentary television yeah it's fucking 15

[01:01:46] hour days like media is hard and people don't realize that and they're always

[01:01:50] like oh these people are striking fucking these millionaire babies it was like no

[01:01:54] this lady is probably making seven dollars got killed by a stupid cannon for a

[01:01:59] thing that'll never rerun well it's like that's so depressing but no matter

[01:02:03] where you are whether you're in pennsylvania or la or whatever it's like 15

[01:02:07] hour days it's just too fucking common it's a lot yeah it's a lot of hours and

[01:02:10] actually i think suzanne sounds awesome in the cnn article she talks about on

[01:02:15] another set where she mangled her hand dude you guys gonna start working some

[01:02:19] union jobs here man and dealing with her type 1 diabetes during production

[01:02:23] on a different set this is the quote that made me think she's really one of us ed

[01:02:28] she said quote i like covering stories that show the

[01:02:31] spectrum of america's quirks and there's a lot to learn from each one

[01:02:34] i've enjoyed the adventure and you know life is dangerous

[01:02:37] you can't let those concerns stop you from living it from living it well and

[01:02:41] fully it's a big big world and it's an interesting world and i want to see as

[01:02:45] much of it as i can i don't think anything is going to change that that is

[01:02:49] awesome so hell yeah she's great but she needs to realize maybe do a couple

[01:02:53] stories where you're not 10 minutes away from becoming brain balls yeah say i'm

[01:02:58] glad she survived we didn't have to add her to sudden death part two i'll also say

[01:03:03] if we ever do a television show of this podcast she's now on my list of

[01:03:07] producers yeah still working but this event is far from the weirdest accident

[01:03:11] or crime that's taken place in a pumpkin patch for that we turn our frightened

[01:03:16] gaze to a list i discovered on listverse.com titled 10 crimes committed in a

[01:03:22] pumpkin patch weird weird weird that this list exists yeah i did not write this

[01:03:28] list uh this was just floating out there on the internet and i will say most of

[01:03:33] these are crimes some of them we're stretching the definition a little bit

[01:03:38] but number 10 is called police chase in a corn maze

[01:03:43] the article says quote one man from california tried thinking outside the

[01:03:48] box while on the run from police and his plan surprisingly involved the local

[01:03:52] petaluma pumpkin patch the man was accused of stalking an ex-girlfriend and fled the

[01:03:58] scene when officers arrived to arrest him he managed to flee into the corn maze at a

[01:04:03] nearby pumpkin patch the maze was so intricate and well designed that he avoided the police

[01:04:08] and a helicopter for two hours yeah he was he was fucking lost like he couldn't get out

[01:04:14] well but apparently neither could the police or the helicopter you'd think they'd be able

[01:04:18] to look straight down into the maze and be like there he is no but he's homer simpsoning

[01:04:22] into the bushes this must have been a 4d corn maze that's so crazy slip into the space

[01:04:27] between spaces i hope whoever designed this maze won like some sort of award for complexity they went

[01:04:35] back to hell or whatever like whatever that um hp lovecraft invention yeah it's a non-euclidean corn

[01:04:42] maze one officer who had been to the maze before while off duty even acknowledged how easy it would be to

[01:04:49] hide in the maze so this guy knew eventually the man was discovered hiding in a chicken coop and arrested

[01:04:56] by authorities restoring peace to the pumpkin patch number nine 200 pumpkins stolen this one i think is

[01:05:04] pretty self-explanatory farms view road stand in new jersey was robbed of 200 pumpkins and the thieves

[01:05:10] were caught in the act by security cameras oh wow at first it might not seem like this would be a very

[01:05:16] profitable crime but according to the owner of the pumpkin stand they would have ended up selling

[01:05:20] for close to three thousand dollars oh wow so if you're looking for a fairly safe heist to pull off

[01:05:27] not that i want anyone to prey upon the owners of pumpkin patches but holy shit it's it can't well

[01:05:33] first off what a steal no pun intended hey it's not that safe they got caught and b what that's a

[01:05:38] fucking lot of mass that's a lot of surface area 300 pumpkins 200 pumpkins 200 pumpkins you're gonna

[01:05:46] have to rent a box truck or something yeah you're gonna have to make that weird like assembly line of

[01:05:51] like one person to the next putting them in you can't hide it in your code you can't do it with

[01:05:55] two people yeah well get this the owners of the pumpkin stand were so distraught over the loss of

[01:06:00] the pumpkins they offered a cash reward to anyone who had information on the suspects the robbery itself

[01:06:06] happened in three stages so this was organized pumpkin crime sure the security camera showed a

[01:06:12] vehicle approaching the pumpkin farm three different times during one night and a team of individuals

[01:06:17] jumped out to load up the pumpkins it was a calculated plan for stealing pumpkins and we may

[01:06:23] never know the motive fortunately if the thieves intent was to try and shut down the family-owned

[01:06:28] pumpkin stand they were unsuccessful which i doubt it was i feel like their intent was to try to steal

[01:06:35] pumpkins and sell them this will ruin them if we take these pumpkins just burn it down if you're

[01:06:41] trying to ruin it so they came took a load left yeah came took a load left yeah took a load left

[01:06:47] they came and took a lot of loads i think you can maybe do that with like a fucking nissan centra

[01:06:53] though i don't know if you're doing like that's when i moved in my honda fit even with a truck for

[01:06:58] one big moving load i still had to take multiple loads in my honda fit we need to stop about taking

[01:07:05] loads we need to stop talking about it all right so it seems like even though they were caught on camera

[01:07:09] these guys were never prosecuted so if you or someone you know has over 200 pumpkins do the

[01:07:16] farms view road stand in new jersey a favor and turn yourself in but i thought they were caught on camera

[01:07:21] they were but it didn't say anything about them ever being prosecuted or anything so i don't know

[01:07:25] wow wow number eight drunk driver on october or in october 2018 while turning into the entrance of

[01:07:34] jerry's fall harvest and sunray produce in wisconsin a local man was hit by a drunk driver the man did not

[01:07:41] survive the incident oh and the passenger had to be life flighted to a nearby hospital the owner of the

[01:07:47] pumpkin farm expressed that he was shaken up by the tragedy the drunk driver was arrested and ordered

[01:07:52] not to drive any vehicles in case he posted bail okay well how fast was this guy turning into

[01:08:00] yeah yeah that like two people are like recently hit by a car yeah in another car yeah this guy must

[01:08:07] have been turning into the pumpkin patch at 200 miles an hour yeah or his car was so weighed down

[01:08:13] by stolen pumpkins that it just barreled through people like a tank i guess but i do hate i genuinely hate

[01:08:21] this i do hate how often and i get why because they're not you know they're not tense they're not

[01:08:26] whatever but drunk drivers like always end up living yeah because they're they don't even know

[01:08:30] they're in a fucking accident and then people just so often die yeah well this drunk drivers this

[01:08:36] guy they're going 6 000 miles an hour in a fucking pumpkin cart this guy nicholas hanley 46 was

[01:08:44] formally charged with vehicular homicide driving under the influence with a prior dwi a second count of

[01:08:51] homicide driving above the legal intoxication limit two felony counts of causing injury by intoxicated use

[01:08:58] of a vehicle and two other dwi related offenses with three prior convictions for dwi hanley also had a

[01:09:06] blood alcohol level of 0.087 his last conviction was in 2006 uh his license was restored in 2007

[01:09:13] after all of this in august 2022 he was sentenced to five years in prison so yeah but this is america so

[01:09:19] he got off in 16 days like 16 days later he was back to drive over people again yeah i mean i hope

[01:09:26] nicholas hanley but also five years five years for vehicular homicide that and other time other multiple

[01:09:31] counts of homicide so yeah that's not enough time so you know my joke about it being 16 days which

[01:09:36] realistically it wasn't he didn't even do five fucking years but like that's yeah you fucking killed

[01:09:42] somebody and then potentially another person and like you have a history of almost killing or killing

[01:09:48] people fuck man it makes no sense you got people who were in prison for like having a joint in 1978

[01:09:52] for 30 years it seems like at the very least this would and i don't know like i totally i believe in

[01:09:58] restorative justice i don't think people should go to jail for the rest of their lives except for the

[01:10:02] most heinous crimes but but when it's your fifth time doing it well it's your fifth time doing it i feel

[01:10:07] like if you're gonna be let out you should also never be allowed to get a driver's license again

[01:10:11] yeah you also aren't allowed to be on the road without insurance and three of the five vehicles

[01:10:16] involved in this pileup i was in didn't have insurance true so this guy is just gonna be like

[01:10:20] yeah i'll get in a car fuck it number seven i'm calling crime and pumpkin schmidt uh they should

[01:10:27] hire you at that other badly named uh event at the pumpkin chunkin zunkin according to one woman

[01:10:34] while on a date ed we're back to talking about dates here while on a date at mccall's pumpkin patch

[01:10:40] in new mexico she absent-mindedly picked up a two dollar pumpkin from a display stand

[01:10:44] she says she then wandered off neglecting to pay for it whenona rider after being infronted

[01:10:51] miss rider reported that she was that she offered to pay for the pumpkin but her request was denied

[01:10:58] and she was escorted from the property in handcuffs and this is this is where it turns into a real

[01:11:02] nightmare she got 24 years she had 24 year sentence i mean so because it was her first offense

[01:11:09] the situation escalated even further when the couple i guess the guy got roped into this appeared

[01:11:15] in court the presiding judge decided to rule based on the intention to steal and not the dollar amount

[01:11:22] of the item which again was two dollars since that was the case the couple was found guilty of

[01:11:28] shoplifting an item of 250 or less in value and were each sentenced to 40 hours of community service

[01:11:34] and had to pay 73 in court fees all for a pumpkin worth less than five dollars i mean i kind of it's

[01:11:41] interesting let's say a pumpkin's worth two dollars this other pumpkin crime where it was like you're

[01:11:46] moving three thousand dollars with the pumpkins yeah feels a little bit like how the cops are like

[01:11:51] we took this cocaine off the street with a street value of two million dollars and it was like what

[01:11:56] are you talking about like that's just cop lingo of how expensive things are maybe that's what the

[01:12:01] guys are stealing the pumpkins for was to fill them with cocaine and then move maybe but it just

[01:12:06] seems like yeah this is three thousand dollars worth of pumpkins it was like well here's the next

[01:12:10] story where a pumpkin costs two dollars yeah i mean i look i don't know why this small pumpkin

[01:12:14] i don't know why this lady that had the book thrown at her when they're really lenient with a

[01:12:18] man who drove 64 000 miles an hour into a pumpkin patch killed a bunch of people need to be

[01:12:24] airlifted out and then this lady was like hey what do you where are you going with that yeah you're

[01:12:28] going to prison with that they threw the book at her yeah dude the necronomicon number six another

[01:12:35] chase through another maze two brothers ended up in a dangerous situation while playing in a corn maze on

[01:12:41] a california pumpkin farm the boys had been having fun in the maze and became separated from their family

[01:12:46] after a while the younger brother noticed two suspicious men following them before the kids could

[01:12:52] lose them in the maze the boys said one of the men grabbed the younger brother by the arm and tried

[01:12:56] to drag him away fuck that to defend his sibling the elder boy kicked the man quote in the crotch

[01:13:02] good the boys managed to flee from the maze into the pumpkin patch to find their family and call

[01:13:07] the police that's all that it says and i think this one's maybe the actual scariest one on here can you

[01:13:13] imagine being a kid in a corn maze and a guy starts trying to drag you away no you're already

[01:13:20] lost in the maze presumably because it's a maze yeah and there's just a fucking psycho i don't know

[01:13:27] these kids though you know i mean they could have just stolen a display pumpkin oh i see and it's

[01:13:31] actually security guards saying get over here that's worth two dollars and the rest of your

[01:13:35] life in prison but they got away they kicked him in the dick this doesn't sound like that this

[01:13:40] sounds more like no predator there's a predator there's a 100 percent a fucking pumpkin maze predator

[01:13:46] state of california yeah shambles so that's all we know about this case but that one that's really

[01:13:51] frightening to me that and actually i'm kind of surprised you've never seen something like that

[01:13:55] done well at least in a movie i'm sure there's something like it in a schlock movie but like

[01:14:00] a getting lost in a corn maze and getting stalked by a guy is a pretty creepy thing pumpkin patches look

[01:14:05] at what we got you try and drive into them you're gonna die you try and walk through them you're gonna

[01:14:09] fucking get snatched you try and go there just to enjoy it there's gonna be like another a stalker

[01:14:14] like the other person was a creep-ass stalker peering around i think you know what pumpkin

[01:14:19] patches during the day only and on the perim only the perimeter number five this one gets political

[01:14:25] bert's pumpkin farm in georgia found itself front and center of a high profile court case where a

[01:14:31] journalist was arrested for filming at a political rally which i guess the rally was taking place at

[01:14:38] bert's pumpkin farm okay tensions grew during the rally at the pumpkin patch as one of the political

[01:14:43] candidates asked the journalist why she was filming well it's a fucking political rally it doesn't seem

[01:14:48] there seems like a lot of people should be filming yeah growing uncomfortable with the confrontations

[01:14:53] the property owners decided to have local law enforcement step in the journalist reported having

[01:14:58] permission to film and did not stop resulting in her being forcefully removed chaos began to unfold as

[01:15:06] the officer did not respond to the woman's calls for him to identify himself as a member of law

[01:15:11] enforcement this caused a scuffle that resulted in her the journalist being taken into custody which

[01:15:16] all sounds kind of like a i mean i guess she's on private property so maybe it's not impinging on

[01:15:22] her freedom of speech but still yeah what kind of um political rally are you holding you know i mean the

[01:15:28] political rallies are held for publicity i need to speak to the people i need to get my message out about

[01:15:33] what my plan is what my one would assume and so yeah it's weird that they have like a blackout on that

[01:15:39] and then officers who won't identify themselves i think you just stumbled into like an illuminati

[01:15:44] meeting yeah was this pumpkin patch at bohemian groves yeah for real dude but also i do hate i mean

[01:15:50] i hate anyone i'm not saying this was a person who's doing but you ever just like watch those videos

[01:15:55] online of like the most obnoxious people in the world people who are like filming yeah and it's like

[01:16:00] it's my right i'm on a public road yeah and i'm allowed to do this i'm like if you get fucking

[01:16:06] pushed off that sidewalk i'm not really empathizing with you yeah there aren't any details in this

[01:16:11] story about how this person was behaving and and to what degree she was a journalist or just an

[01:16:17] annoying person with the camera yeah but i think what i'm talking about is usually like on a sidewalk

[01:16:22] someone's walking out of a hairdresser yeah or like they walk on to like police property and they try

[01:16:28] and be obnoxious because it's like it's my right i'm a taxpayer this they said a political rally was

[01:16:33] going on so it really seems unusual that they would have this uh but again i guess it's a crime

[01:16:38] in a pumpkin patch so it's on the list well and get this the case was monitored for several years by

[01:16:44] the media a ruling was reached and the journalist did not have to serve jail time but she did get

[01:16:50] charged to pay a one thousand dollar fine and complete community service to have a misdemeanor

[01:16:56] charge completely removed from her record wow so once again railroaded getting in kind of more trouble

[01:17:01] than the drunk driver guy no the drunk driver i mean like like uh a crime to punishment punishment

[01:17:08] ratio yeah fuck uh pumpkin patches i never thought i'd say this they're like we need to make news ed

[01:17:15] we need we need to not go to them no i don't know if you should be on the record saying that

[01:17:21] we should absolutely go to pumpkin patches but i feel like there's a greater chance of there's

[01:17:26] insanity happening versus like the news is like if you go into the subway in new york and you get

[01:17:30] pushed in front of a subway train like you have a greater chance of getting abducted stalked hit or

[01:17:36] put in prison by going to a pumpkin pumpkin patch well number four pumpkin atm theft most pumpkin farms

[01:17:43] have treats available for purchase or at least charge an entrance fee for their corn maze but not

[01:17:48] everyone carries cash on them all the time yeah these pumpkin patches don't want to pay taxes

[01:17:51] um so they're gonna report a totally different number so we need you to pay in cash live oak canyon

[01:17:57] pumpkin farm in redlands believe they had managed to avoid the problem of their visitors not having

[01:18:03] cash because they had an atm available for customers they did not realize that the machine

[01:18:08] would cause them a different type of problem one night two men in a van drove up to the

[01:18:13] and stole the entire atm oh my god they managed this by cutting the security card and loading the

[01:18:20] machine into their rental van however the team was caught on surveillance discarding the machine

[01:18:25] after breaking into it the authorities recovered the atm and calculated the thieves had gotten

[01:18:30] nineteen thousand dollars out of it oh my god that's a lot of pumpkins both men were eventually

[01:18:36] arrested and sentenced to jail time and the police were able to recover two thousand dollars of the

[01:18:41] money from the pumpkin farms atm okay it sounds like there's like seventeen thousand dollars in those

[01:18:46] top pockets yeah they were like wow hail us the conquering hero police we've retrieved two thousand

[01:18:53] dollars and by the way it seems like they had this a night so what the fuck did they it's like yo

[01:18:57] some people took that money dude yeah it's it's floating number three we make a return to a highly

[01:19:03] criminal pumpkin patch at the same pumpkin patch where the woman was arrested for stealing the small

[01:19:09] pumpkin oh my god yeah 10 years later another dramatic situation unfolded perhaps to make the maze at

[01:19:17] mccall's pumpkin patch extra challenging a man from new mexico entered while intoxicated

[01:19:24] law enforcement interrupted the man in the middle of harassing and head butting the actors performing in

[01:19:31] the court makes just inappropriate behavior yeah deputies reported they could smell alcohol on his breath as

[01:19:41] he got in their faces and refused to exit the pumpkin patch peacefully the man was handcuffed when he spit in the

[01:19:47] deputy's face oh wow but that did not stop him from causing a scene much to the embarrassment of his friends

[01:19:53] according to the authorities the man kept up his performance all the way to jail where they were like

[01:19:59] if only he had stolen a pumpkin we could have put him away for life but since you only spit in our

[01:20:04] faces and headbutted everyone that's gonna be putting two months community service yeah number two pumpkin

[01:20:10] assault a video on social media challenging viewers to wreck mayhem was taken seriously by a group of

[01:20:18] teenagers at roca berry farm in nebraska as a result of the incident at the pumpkin farm two girls 13 and 14

[01:20:26] years old were injured it doesn't say how exactly anyone was causing havoc or wrecking mayhem at this

[01:20:33] pumpkin farm but apparently it was enough to injure these girls they had to be treated at the hospital

[01:20:38] the injuries were not serious police used snapchat to identify the suspects the pumpkin patch increased

[01:20:44] its security presence as a response to the event and no longer allows children under the age of 15

[01:20:49] to enter without an adult wow and number one this one i'm sorry this should not be on the list as a

[01:20:55] crime this is a children's book story at best yet it tops the list but it's on the list so i'm gonna

[01:21:01] read it quote anyone driving down the highway near gebert's pumpkin patch and apple orchard in chicago

[01:21:08] one afternoon would be in for a huge surprise a police chase was in progress but not of people

[01:21:14] two zebras had escaped from the petting zoo in the local pumpkin patch what the illinois state police

[01:21:20] had to work together with the zoo to contain the wild wink wink situation the zebras managed to hang

[01:21:27] on to their freedom for two hours before they were safely captured in their defense the article states

[01:21:32] zebras probably did not know that running from police was a crime it would be better if it was like

[01:21:37] around halloween it was actually just four kids and two zebra costumes yeah pretty um pretty not

[01:21:44] criminal but i guess this this is how hard it is to come up with other bad things that happen in and

[01:21:50] around pumpkins that they had to turn to to freedom zebras yeah i don't know it's i i will say that list

[01:21:58] did turn me off from pumpkin patches though so all right well never going back hey look if we've learned

[01:22:03] anything here today there's one more thing i want people to learn because we're not giving up on this

[01:22:13] episode yet in my research i found something not pumpkin related but halloween adjacent enough that

[01:22:21] i thought it was well worth closing out this episode with you may remember our episode on booby

[01:22:26] trap candy last year and i didn't want to repeat myself so i stayed away from booby trap candy but i found

[01:22:31] something candy related that still made my stomach turn they're called morgue chocolates and

[01:22:39] and they're pretty fucked up now to me morgue chocolates sounds like uh something that gets like

[01:22:45] put like like the way that a hotel will leave a chocolate on your pillow or something yeah like

[01:22:50] it sound i thought this was going to be a legend about somebody who like leaves little candies

[01:22:54] in the morgue trays or something i don't know why that job would exist but right now we can use jobs

[01:23:00] so hopefully they get created i think of it less as a job and probably more of a hobby for somebody

[01:23:04] well speaking of real fast i was at dairy queen today okay and the people who'd gotten dairy queen

[01:23:11] before me at i don't know fucking 11 in the morning or something uh-huh maybe even earlier

[01:23:17] um because i was waiting for a friend so i was just sitting there working and i look up and it's these

[01:23:21] four people dressed in like kind of militarized uniforms which is weird like i wouldn't expect the

[01:23:26] forensic department to dress like they're the capital police but i'm saying four people with the

[01:23:32] forensic badge across the back uh are all just eating blizzards um in full forensic uniforms

[01:23:38] and i was like did a crime like did you just finish chalk outlining someone and now you're

[01:23:43] gonna have a blizzard break hey you know what it's a stressful job man it is yeah but it's just made me

[01:23:48] laugh to look up and just see a bunch of like fully uniformed on the job forensic people eating

[01:23:54] blizzards yeah that that's a great image speaking of images you sort of need to hit google image search

[01:24:01] to get how creepy this morgue chocolate situation really is so i encourage you to hit that search bar

[01:24:08] or go to the show notes and search morgue chocolates is it safe for work yeah oh good yeah

[01:24:14] kinda what you'll see are not chocolates served at a morgue uh no what you'll see are chocolates

[01:24:20] displayed in a candy box like any kind of russell stover spread but look closely at those candies

[01:24:27] look at what shapes they are here's a hint if you can't tell they're all wounds what they're all wounds

[01:24:34] and twists they're all real wounds made from molds made from real corpses oh what who the fuck are

[01:24:41] they doing over there russell stover this is all part of an art project ongoing art project that has

[01:24:47] been undertaken by artist steven shanabrook the son of an obstetrician and a coroner who started making

[01:24:54] these candies which at first seemed like they weren't available for purchase like for private

[01:24:59] purchase but then i saw somebody i think on reddit say that they are so you may be able to buy these

[01:25:04] candies for yourself he started making them as an art project in russia i mean maybe like access to your

[01:25:10] dad's corpses are a little easier in russia well in an interview with vice in 2009 he said quote

[01:25:16] i was living in holland at the time and a curator asked me to go to russia with a group of dutch

[01:25:22] artists and i had just made an addition of chocolate teeth i call oh my god sir

[01:25:29] i had just made an addition of chocolate teeth called i eat people they eat me with teeth i collected from

[01:25:36] dentists in holland we were talking about moscow and they said there was a huge chocolate factory in

[01:25:42] the center of moscow a very famous old factory so i got to thinking ellipses end quote and i guess what

[01:25:50] he was thinking was that he could go to morgues in russia and make molds from the fatal wounds of

[01:25:56] anonymous victims including gunshot wounds stitch skin protruding eyeballs and then create chocolates

[01:26:04] from those molds i mean what is that like port of entry conversation when it was like oh your purpose

[01:26:11] for entering our country yeah what is it is it business or pleasure well it's sort of a long story

[01:26:17] a little bit of both you see what i'd like is access to your corpses uh sir you can't come in here well

[01:26:23] can a bribe of chocolate teeth change your mind yeah the craziest one that he's done is actually an

[01:26:29] entire sculpture and i have a link to a video showing this sculpture in show notes uh an entire

[01:26:35] sculpture titled on the road to heaven the highway to hell oh what this guy by the way two times in a

[01:26:43] row could have shortened these titles the first one's like i eat you eat everybody eats teeth they

[01:26:48] sound the second one is equally stupidly long sound like uh mid-2000s emo songs oh my god this this

[01:26:55] sculpture of his on the road to heaven the highway to hell is a full mold of the remnants of a suicide

[01:27:03] bomber so it's the upper half of a man with his entrails splayed everywhere but the entire sculpture

[01:27:10] is made out of chocolate and this was a mold presumably made on scene on the they're not gonna

[01:27:16] wait i mean maybe that's what the forensic guys i saw were they had to like wait till the chocolate

[01:27:22] sculptor came and so they had to sit there and eat fucking sweet treats until they were done at the

[01:27:27] crime scene making a mold of somebody well here here ed i'll show you i'll show you this video and

[01:27:33] i kind of think people should look it up it's a little graphic i don't know that i'd say it's safe

[01:27:37] for work the last time you showed me a video in an episode i saw someone die so it is just chocolate

[01:27:43] this it's only like a 15 second long video it's not very long okay i'm watching this is in fact

[01:27:48] a dead person made of chocolate i see their entrails it looks like they have a hood on it's actually

[01:27:55] beautifully it's not beautiful in any like way but there's definitely this person's good at their job

[01:28:00] this is well well done yeah i don't know how he took the mold of this guy especially how he took the

[01:28:06] mold of the entrails yeah that's why i'm thinking maybe it's you know sculpted suicide bomber i don't

[01:28:12] know where the guy came from yeah i mean i'm sure a couple google searches away from getting that answer

[01:28:18] but who has the time so why do any of this i didn't ask that but i'm sure society did every

[01:28:23] time they saw one of his new art projects every time that he had to go in or out of a country

[01:28:29] um steven explains himself in an interview i found on this kind of random blog i think the original

[01:28:34] interview might have been in russian and what i'm reading here is a bit of an odd translation but

[01:28:39] you'll get the idea he's a dutch guy who went to russia i think he was in america he's an american

[01:28:45] who was with a group of dutch artists in holland and they brought up this idea of going to moscow

[01:28:51] okay so anyway you are who you hang out with steven says it is exactly the banality of the

[01:28:57] chocolate that makes the image so powerful because the viewer is caught off guard i'd say yeah the

[01:29:04] familiarity smell and the hidden psychological effect of chocolate are the most influential

[01:29:09] aspect of the morgue chocolate series by exhibiting wounds in a chocolate box motif the mold of a

[01:29:15] shotgun wound to the face becomes desirable to the viewer no it doesn't that is you're wrong sir

[01:29:21] you can put whatever you want in your paragraph on that plaque next to it also where does this take

[01:29:27] place you turn the heat up in that room it's just a box of goop well just like the person whose mold

[01:29:32] this was taken from yeah even though one would not admit it the desire is there and so begins the

[01:29:39] conflict for the viewer don't get me wrong i'd eat it this smell is overpowering to the point where you

[01:29:43] cannot come to grips with what one is seeing so much so that you begin to wonder what you were really

[01:29:48] looking at so yeah i guess it's true there is a different dimension to viewing these morgue chocolates

[01:29:54] in person because you are experiencing them as candy much more than when you just see them visually

[01:30:01] i mean i would the smell i would split a box of fucking face wounds with someone i mean chocolate

[01:30:07] chocolate we eat fucking chocolate bunnies the big question here is why did he not fill them all with

[01:30:11] like different fillings like oh my god who has the time to make the map a popped eyeball filled with

[01:30:17] marshmallow or a shotgun blast to the face filled with raspberry jam i think because there's no intention

[01:30:23] to eat these maybe i guess how is it he says that we should desire to eat the representation

[01:30:30] hold on i should try to do this without laughing this is such an artist thing to say but also again

[01:30:35] remember he's saying it so this is he's projecting his desires a lot most people probably saw this

[01:30:41] shrugged and went okay right you couldn't you couldn't call the collection whatever yeah quote

[01:30:47] how is it that we should desire to eat the representation of another's pain the chocolates are made

[01:30:52] in a sense to be digested mentally or physically removed for the living to process again but not to

[01:30:59] acquaint us with death per se but to nourish life consumption alone has become the manner in which

[01:31:06] life is sustained in this state life's processes cannot come full circle upended in a single direction

[01:31:14] movements both physical and psychological become stilted and reactionary furthermore chocolate and

[01:31:22] blood function at similar temperatures and as fluids they both have come down through history as offerings

[01:31:28] to the gods or at least as remedies for curing some inner melancholy okay does that the blood makes

[01:31:34] sense but who the fuck's like i made this chocolate fountain for zeus like nobody's fucking

[01:31:40] well no the aztecs had their the they would drink like hot chocolate or you know their version of hot

[01:31:47] chocolate which was a much thicker oh i didn't know that yeah yeah it was hot chocolate and the

[01:31:52] consuming of chocolate at least in aztec cultures was a like a communion with the gods kind of thing

[01:31:58] but is cocaine made from cacao beans yes i mean that's out there there you go like chocolate's a

[01:32:03] hell of a drug dude um chocolate's a hell of a drug put that down for a button of the month

[01:32:09] here it is chocolate's a hell of a drug in like curved font over just a pile of white powder oh shit

[01:32:16] shit that's actually it's gonna be hard to do that actually i was instead maybe just gonna make

[01:32:20] a mold of it yeah or that so steven shannon brooke also has one other piece in the candy space i want

[01:32:26] to mention because the title makes me crack up it's a piece of performance art called slapped in the

[01:32:32] face until your shit turns red he needs to shorten these fucking titles buddy that's a great title

[01:32:37] though here standing against a white wall shannon brooke places a cotton candy machine modified with fans in

[01:32:44] front of his face that slaps him with the red and fluffy substance according to the artist the cotton

[01:32:50] candy performance for me is a simple gesture to conjure up feelings of forcing one's beliefs on others

[01:32:56] even beliefs that seem sweetly correct this action is the interpretation of a mental torture for the

[01:33:03] unwilling recipient so it kind of sounds like um who is that girl that did the i make shitty robots or

[01:33:10] whatever on youtube oh my gosh she's great she is shimon gertz yeah she is great but slapped in the

[01:33:15] face until your shit turns red sounds like a machine she would make or would tell you later that

[01:33:21] the intention was to comb my hair and it ended up slapping me in the face till my shit turned red yeah

[01:33:25] well instead i set out to do this this is somebody's kid that they have to then explain to

[01:33:31] people i also did leave out i must have accidentally just i didn't type this in here uh and this i guess

[01:33:36] is sort of an important fact when it comes to this artist he did spend some time in his youth working

[01:33:41] at a chocolate factory so he did have some connection to the idea of a chocolate factory and chocolate

[01:33:47] making and it wasn't completely out of left field i kind of feel like if we dug a little deeper it's

[01:33:53] like oh his parents owned the chocolate factory no his dad was an or one of them was an obstetrician and

[01:33:58] one was a morgue technician oh yeah so those are making money so it is it's got a little cash it's

[01:34:03] speaking to his you know i'm just saying chocolate factory work i guess all i was saying is you seem

[01:34:09] kind of like artistic endeavors where you have a safety net in your life in order to pursue them

[01:34:14] yeah yeah true don't know how much money is going to be in in 73 word titled chocolate and cotton

[01:34:22] candy rile people up art to be fair i would love to live in a world where there is a lot of money in

[01:34:27] that so or just a universal basic income so we can go off and or just yeah or live in a world where

[01:34:32] you're born into privilege suffice it to say steven shanenbrook if you're listening to this

[01:34:37] i would love to know what you would do with gummy bears so hit us up when you get when you get to

[01:34:42] them because i'm sure it's going to be a masterpiece i don't know gum gummy is actually very difficult to

[01:34:47] manipulate and deal with i think so i think like gelatin and he's not he's not prepared i don't think

[01:34:52] he's at that fucking level he's not at that fucking level yeah who do you think you are jeff coons

[01:34:57] no um it would be cool if he had collabs where it was like him you know jeff coons ex steven

[01:35:04] shanenbrook yeah giant latex inflatable exploded guy yeah well ed that brings us to the fear tier for

[01:35:12] this episode where are we putting jack-o-lanterns on the fear tier one one very low and listen folks

[01:35:20] the longer this show goes the more ones there's gonna be so especially when it comes to like

[01:35:25] themed stuff like we're in october yeah buckle up they're not all gonna be tens but it was fun

[01:35:31] conversation there's a lot to learn about jack-o-lanterns and possibly even more if you have

[01:35:37] secret obscure christian knowledge about the burning of people in cages uh still give us a five-star

[01:35:43] review please you can write all that crazy shit you want on there just make it five stars five-star reviews

[01:35:49] all around for all of us from us to you we wish you a very happy halloween we hope you watch some

[01:35:56] scary movies we hope you eat a bunch of candy we hope you have fun give yourself one good scare

[01:36:04] check your candy check your candy for razor blades and stay out of those pumpkin patches i'm actually

[01:36:10] gonna put pumpkin patch at a two yeah i'm gonna go yeah pumpkin patch has moved to a two yeah we'll move

[01:36:15] pumpkin patch up to a two because pumpkin patches are apparently like new york in the 70s yeah you're

[01:36:20] gonna get machine gunned to death yeah by a gang with bottles on their fingers yeah um all right

[01:36:26] happy halloween everybody i'm chris collari and i'm ed ficola the show is scared all the time and we will

[01:36:33] see you next week scared all the time is co-produced by chris collari and ed ficola written by chris

[01:36:39] collari edited by ed ficola additional support and keeper of sanity is tess feifel our theme song

[01:36:45] is the track scared by perpetual stew and mr disclaimer is and just a reminder you can now

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