Homunculus History

[00:00:00] This episode includes the usual amount of adult language and graphic discussions you've

[00:00:08] come to expect around here, but in the event it becomes an unusual amount, expect

[00:00:13] another call from me.

[00:00:14] Alright, welcome back to Scared All The Time.

[00:00:17] I'm Chris Calary, and I'm Ed Vacola.

[00:00:20] And this week we're going to take a break from looking at fears about all the fun and exciting

[00:00:25] ways we can die to look at a very specific fear about creating a very specific form of

[00:00:31] life, the homunculus.

[00:00:34] Now I don't know if you've noticed the way Ed and I have, but our culture seems to be

[00:00:38] going through a cycle of interest in creating fake people.

[00:00:41] There's poor things, Lisa Frankenstein, there's reboots of Frankenstein and Bride of

[00:00:47] Frankenstein in the works.

[00:00:49] And that's not even touching on the way that AI has reignited conversations about what

[00:00:54] it means to be alive and conscious.

[00:00:56] This interest isn't new, really most of us know about Mary Shelley's very productive

[00:01:00] stacation with her friends that produced the original Frankenstein manuscript, but long

[00:01:05] before that, as early as the 16th century, philosophers, scientists and alchemists were exploring

[00:01:12] the idea of creating people.

[00:01:14] And they called these creations homunculi, or literally little people in Latin.

[00:01:19] They're not little in the sense of less than human or something, little as in fully formed

[00:01:25] miniature human beings.

[00:01:28] So join Ed and I this week as we get degrees from Mad Scientist University and explore

[00:01:32] the history and lore of homunculi.

[00:01:35] Where did the idea come from?

[00:01:36] Who wanted to make them?

[00:01:37] Why?

[00:01:38] And most importantly, were they ever successful?

[00:01:42] Warning, the answers may scare you.

[00:01:44] What are we?

[00:01:45] Scared.

[00:01:46] When are we?

[00:01:47] All the time.

[00:01:48] Join us.

[00:01:49] Join us.

[00:01:50] Now it is time for time five.

[00:01:54] Stand always at time.

[00:01:55] All right, welcome back.

[00:01:58] First Ed and I just wanted to say thank you so much.

[00:02:00] You guys killed it last week when we said like tell people to join the Facebook page or

[00:02:04] whatever.

[00:02:05] We're closing in on 600 members in the Facebook group now, which is up almost 100 from

[00:02:10] last week.

[00:02:11] So the show is growing.

[00:02:12] It's all thanks to you guys.

[00:02:14] Thank you so much for listening.

[00:02:16] It's still the kind of thing like tell your friends, tell everybody.

[00:02:20] We saw our buddy, Jerm posted that he's been listening to scared all the time a lot on

[00:02:24] Instagram.

[00:02:25] So thank you for that.

[00:02:26] And he has his own podcast that just came out which I don't have the name of in front

[00:02:30] of me at the moment, but he's pretty active on all of our socials.

[00:02:33] I'm sure you guys can find him.

[00:02:34] It's a pretty unique name.

[00:02:35] So congrats Jerm on starting a new journey and for listening to the show all the time being

[00:02:40] a very supportive and active member of our community.

[00:02:42] Yeah.

[00:02:43] Thank you so much everybody.

[00:02:44] And trying to keep up with the messages in the Facebook and like it's just so cool.

[00:02:48] Some of you guys have such great theories.

[00:02:50] Someone on the Facebook page shared a theory that the reason people don't move when they

[00:02:57] die from spontaneous human combustion is because the fire starts so intensely and so suddenly

[00:03:03] and with such heat that it burns all the nerves instantaneously.

[00:03:07] So they don't feel anything when they're burning from the inside because it like combusts

[00:03:13] and cinches all their nerves.

[00:03:14] And so they don't move because they don't feel anything.

[00:03:16] Which I think is a great idea.

[00:03:18] Yeah.

[00:03:19] We also had somebody who reached out on the Facebook page and said that they had read or

[00:03:23] had access to and college the original flogiston texts.

[00:03:28] Whoa.

[00:03:29] Like the original writings on Flogiston, which is so cool.

[00:03:32] And like that's part of the fun for Ed and I doing this show is building this community

[00:03:37] of people who have all this strange information and wild ideas.

[00:03:43] And it's fantastic.

[00:03:44] So thank you so much.

[00:03:45] We're going to keep growing.

[00:03:46] We're just going to keep making it the best we can be.

[00:03:48] So Ed, do you have any updates on the Patreon stuff that we've been promising to people?

[00:03:53] Yeah.

[00:03:54] It's always in Flux.

[00:03:55] So most recent update on that is we've been approached by Supercast which is another

[00:04:01] Patreon style.

[00:04:02] I guess there's like a bunch of ways now that people can support the show and get unique

[00:04:06] content and we're just looking into that.

[00:04:08] I really liked what we saw from those guys over there and it's something I think we're

[00:04:12] going to internally test out and see if we like it.

[00:04:15] And if we do, you know, that might be the thing we do over Patreon.

[00:04:18] We don't know yet but there will be a thing very soon.

[00:04:21] We're just wanting to find something that we think is cool and will be the best end user

[00:04:25] experience for whoever jumps on board.

[00:04:27] Yeah.

[00:04:28] I don't know if any of you guys are supporters of my favorite murder but they are using

[00:04:33] Supercast that I think they're the highest profile, Supercast podcast.

[00:04:39] So if you support my favorite murder, let us know how you like that interface because

[00:04:43] we're still exploring and figuring it out.

[00:04:45] Yeah, that would be great.

[00:04:46] That would be a huge help to us.

[00:04:47] If anybody follows any shows that are using Supercast, let us know.

[00:04:50] We'd love to know your feedback on that.

[00:04:51] Yeah.

[00:04:52] And on a personal note before we head into the episode, huge loss this week massive RIP and

[00:04:57] God bless to a curatoriama, one of the all-time greats and just a huge part of my childhood

[00:05:03] and some extent my adulthood will get massive, massive loss.

[00:05:06] Yes.

[00:05:07] All right so we're about to get into the episode just one last thing like we set up top

[00:05:11] this week's episode is a little bit of change of pace a little bit later than some

[00:05:15] of the very dark topics we've been covering.

[00:05:17] It's more creepy than actually scary but fuck you it's our show.

[00:05:21] So whether it's scary or not we'll do whatever we want.

[00:05:24] We welcome all kinds of fears here at scared all the time.

[00:05:28] So without further ado let's dive into the small world of the homunculus.

[00:05:32] No pun intended or maybe pun wasn't intended.

[00:05:34] I don't know.

[00:05:35] The small world pun definitely intended.

[00:05:37] So I have to give Ed credit for suggesting this topic.

[00:05:40] He's actually been pushing to do an episode on homunculus since we started the podcast and

[00:05:44] I'm not entirely sure why he's so obsessed with them other than maybe he secretly wants

[00:05:48] to create an entire society of homunculi to worship and fear him.

[00:05:51] So Ed, the floor is yours.

[00:05:53] How afraid of these little creatures are you and how did you find out about them even?

[00:05:57] I'm not afraid of them in the sense of like oh no there's a homunculus in the corner

[00:06:01] but maybe that would be the case soon.

[00:06:03] I think I just was reading something one time and they had come up or the process of making

[00:06:10] them it come up and it was like super gross and disgusting.

[00:06:13] And then I think it just came up because of kind of what your opening was talking about

[00:06:17] which was just talking about this fascination right now with making people.

[00:06:21] And I think there was that company in Europe somewhere crisper or whatever who's I guess

[00:06:27] doing genome shit which I feel like in the 70s people were talking about hey let's all

[00:06:32] get together and just not do that.

[00:06:34] Let's just not make people and then like you know they cloned Dolly when we were kids

[00:06:39] well yeah in the 90s they banned it.

[00:06:41] Yeah it felt like we just never heard about that again.

[00:06:43] You know right.

[00:06:44] And then the argument people make for like oh AI is dangerous and AI is scary and AI needs

[00:06:48] to be regulated and I think all of those things are true but there are examples in the past

[00:06:53] of new versioning technology which is being like maybe we shouldn't in that was I believe

[00:06:59] like human genome stuff right like the 70s of consortium of sciences came together

[00:07:03] and be like hey let's just fucking not do this.

[00:07:05] Let's just all agree to not do this and I think that maybe has culminated in what you were

[00:07:09] saying if cloning was in fact banned after Dolly I don't know I mean how are we making

[00:07:15] impossible me I have no idea.

[00:07:17] Well yeah I don't think that's a clone.

[00:07:18] Fuck it.

[00:07:19] Just throwing impossible me in Beyondburgers like that's another good example of like what's

[00:07:23] the fuck are we doing like what is that beat juice what is it when it bleeds like I have

[00:07:27] no idea.

[00:07:28] I don't know if it's impossible meat I've read about one of the meat companies and they're

[00:07:32] essentially just growing like protein chains there's no like I don't think impossible meat

[00:07:37] is ever in danger of like 15 20 years from now someone being a whistleblower like the

[00:07:41] beat was alive.

[00:07:43] I don't know all it takes is fake meat people getting in touch to the 23 in me people and

[00:07:48] be like I got a lot of DNA samples what do you got and it was like we got a hamburger

[00:07:52] that we're trying to put teeth in right so what you're so what you're really afraid of

[00:07:57] here is eating a homunculi hamburger again it's not a thing where I'm like homunculi

[00:08:01] are scary but I just feel like a lot of the thought behind wanting to make it and striving

[00:08:07] to make little people or just little anything or big things or Frankenstein's or things

[00:08:13] in our own image that isn't just shacking up and making a kid like I find that insane

[00:08:20] and it's kind of scary I'm scared of the people who are interested in that it's the

[00:08:24] playing god aspect to you that is those scariest part I guess so because I mean it's funny

[00:08:29] I think my first encounter with homunculi I think was that tree house of horror episode

[00:08:35] where Lisa creates like a whole society in her desk drawer do you remember that yeah

[00:08:40] yeah I mean like it's a real simsons did it first situation I think I'm pretty sure they

[00:08:45] call them homunculi at one point or maybe it's somewhere along the way maybe I just made

[00:08:49] the connection but that was the first place that I encountered them and then actually the

[00:08:53] second place that I encountered homunculi is in the original bride of Frankenstein because

[00:09:00] the first like third of that movie is about a guy doctor Pretorius I think his name is

[00:09:07] doctor Septimus Pretorius which is an all time great name and he's tried to create homunculi

[00:09:14] and he has them in these little jars in his lab and I think maybe one of them escapes at some

[00:09:19] point and they get up to a bunch of hijinks but then doctor Pretorius convinces Dr. Frankenstein

[00:09:24] to resume his experiments that it all spins out from there but it's interesting that I assume

[00:09:29] somebody in the writing of bride of Frankenstein probably you know had made the connection between

[00:09:35] the idea of homunculi kind of being a predecessor to Mary Shelley's Frankenstein and to be honest I've

[00:09:43] never even I don't think I've ever read an original like translation of Frankenstein so there

[00:09:48] may be mention of homunculi in that book and I'm sure the Simpsons probably I haven't seen

[00:09:53] it up so in a thousand years when I'm saying they probably mentioned him like you're either all

[00:09:56] Harvard writers doing that when it was good so they know words yeah that's a good transition a good

[00:10:02] segue because we're gonna define some words here up top but can we pronounce them no there's

[00:10:09] like 15 different words and names in this episode that I probably am gonna fuck up so a couple

[00:10:14] things we should define up top some terms and words so first we're gonna try to keep the discussion

[00:10:19] focused on pure homunculi so no elves no leprechauns no fairies if you want a podcast about being afraid

[00:10:26] of leprechauns there are plenty of podcasts for babies out there uh we also aren't gonna be talking

[00:10:33] about a fear of shrinking or being shrunk that's a very valid fear that I think about all the time

[00:10:39] and how I would fight a spider with like a sewing needle but homunculi are created small so if anything

[00:10:47] we should be more afraid of them growing very big and finally I just wanted to find when we say

[00:10:53] small like when we're talking about little people in this episode we mean very small like a few

[00:10:59] inches tall just to help give you a mental image like do you know how tall a smurf is at least

[00:11:05] as tall as a smurf yes well actually that's the other thing we were just texting the other night

[00:11:09] cat Williams talks about homunculi on a clip from uh Joe Rogan podcast yeah where he's talking

[00:11:16] about how they are homunculi yeah he got gorgamel made them cat Williams has a theory that the

[00:11:22] smurfs are homunculi and it's an evil show and and it shouldn't be watching because gorgamel made

[00:11:27] them I don't know if his theory is that it's evil I think he was just saying that some people

[00:11:30] consider it evil because it's for whatever religious reasons I guess you shouldn't make smurf at

[00:11:36] if you want to have a lot of fun with this episode just imagine that we're talking about smurfs

[00:11:40] the entire time and it'll get exponentially funnier so yeah but also like the reason I brought up

[00:11:47] smurfs even besides the things that were texting with each other before recording is that and I maybe

[00:11:52] I've mentioned this on the show before I don't know but I love the measurement of smurfs like

[00:11:57] smurfs are three apples tall that's their measurement there are three apples tall like I mean obviously

[00:12:03] somebody's always gonna be like oh what kind of apples fucking granny Smith like fuck off who cares

[00:12:07] it's just three apples tall so I guess homunculi by cat Williams definition are three apples tall

[00:12:13] I also speaking of demonic things about smurfs no one was doing that what yeah well cat Williams was

[00:12:20] yes but I love smurfs I also love the snorcs so I have no problem with this stuff uh I'm on cat

[00:12:25] Williams side the smurfs are demonic because the last time one of the smurf movies came out I walked

[00:12:31] past one of the big you know like posters that they put up on like construction walls and stuff

[00:12:36] like those big oh you're talking about the smurfs live action movies I actually worked on one of

[00:12:41] those but yeah I'm sorry you're talking about the smurfs I'm talking about the smurfs live action

[00:12:44] movie because I had never noticed until I walked by this massive high definition render of a smurf

[00:12:53] and looked at their skin that I realized a smurf must feel like a fucking dolphin or something it

[00:12:59] was like this waxy blue skin snorke a snork definitely and I think I always thought in my mind

[00:13:04] that they were like cuddly or like soft or puffy or something and then when I walk past that and

[00:13:10] saw what smurf skin would actually look like it's disgusting I don't want anything to do with them

[00:13:16] I I feel like I'd be friends with smurfs they seem like they have it there's there are a lot of fun

[00:13:21] yeah until you touch one and chuck it I need to touch them I have dozens of friends I've never touched

[00:13:26] so it's fine that's not a prerequisite of being my friend sure yeah I'd hang out we talk about

[00:13:34] smurf stuff I'd give them the news of like stuff they can't see over like oh over there pass

[00:13:38] the mushrooms there's actually they're putting in a buffalo wild wings you know pretty cool stuff

[00:13:44] so yeah they are wacky and they're weird and I guess they're potentially demonic I have no

[00:13:48] problem with smurfs the snorks I have a little bit more of a problem with because you know they're

[00:13:51] aquatic but don't do a gargamel does don't don't do a gargamel does so to understand where the idea

[00:14:00] of the humunculi came from we first have to understand a little bit about the ancient practice of alchemy

[00:14:07] now this episode is going to be for the history heads because there's a lot of information here about

[00:14:13] alchemy and it's all relevant but it's also just very interesting I don't know a ton about alchemy

[00:14:21] so this research I found really interesting for a lot of different reasons that we'll get to but

[00:14:25] basically this is where I was starting from I always thought alchemy was basically just the attempt

[00:14:32] to turn common metals into gold but it turns out there is a lot more to it an outline of an alchemy

[00:14:40] course offered at the University of Hawaii defines the ancient practice as a cosmic art by which parts

[00:14:47] of that cosmos the mineral and animal parts can be liberated from their temporal existence and

[00:14:53] attained states of perfection gold in the case of minerals and for humans longevity immortality

[00:14:59] and redemption such transformations can be brought about on one hand by the use of a material

[00:15:05] substance such as the quote philosopher stone or elixir or on the other hand by revelatory knowledge

[00:15:11] or psychological enlightenment so right off the bat we're getting a lot deeper into the alchemical

[00:15:18] weeds than I even knew existed like I'd heard philosopher stone I guess somewhere in the back of my

[00:15:24] head I knew that alchemists also searched for immortality but I didn't really know how it all

[00:15:30] connected well I have a question yes Ed in the back raising your hand thank you thank you so alchemists

[00:15:36] you're like oh alchemists were searching for philosopher stone they want to make gold they wanted

[00:15:39] longevity they want to what have you but I also feel like alchemists was like a position like a

[00:15:44] cabinet position at least in like fantasy novels it's never just like a rogue alchemist it's always

[00:15:51] like oh this is the king's alchemist and so the king the rich they want long life they want more

[00:15:57] gold they want shit yeah so it does feel like a job that's gotta be like how's it coming with

[00:16:04] the gold yeah then you have to just lie all the time and be like oh it's still I don't know led

[00:16:10] and it's like we're drinking lots of mercury and we're not getting any longer lives

[00:16:15] so it's gotta be a scary role to have where you know you probably are pretty high society you got

[00:16:20] a lab they're probably throwing you some coin to do the job but you got to be on the chopping block

[00:16:25] every couple weeks yeah well there's there's definitely throughout this is a lot of royal alchemists

[00:16:31] and higher society people I think something that's really interesting that we'll get into in a bit

[00:16:35] though is that alchemy it was the birth of a lot of science like a lot of modern science god it's

[00:16:43] roots in alchemy because basically alchemy was really the study of the natural world before the

[00:16:51] natural world and the supernatural were very separate separate from each other so the roots of

[00:16:58] alchemy can be traced all the way back to Aristotle in the mid-300s BC and Aristotle had what we'd

[00:17:05] consider a rational though not technically scientific understanding of the world around him so in

[00:17:10] other words Aristotle undeniably brilliant guy who made a lot of observations and hypotheses

[00:17:17] grounded in his observations but he never put his theories to empirical testing so I don't

[00:17:24] remember high school science all that well but I'm pretty sure the scientific method is big on

[00:17:28] testing and measuring conclusions and adjusting your thinking based on those results I wish it stopped

[00:17:35] at have an idea because I think I probably would have done a lot better at science if all you had

[00:17:40] to do was think and observe and be like what about this yeah and had Aristotle tested things he might

[00:17:46] have changed his mind about some of his theories one of his big ones that was a whiff was the theory

[00:17:50] that women have fewer teeth than men which I feel like is a pretty pretty easy one to check well

[00:17:58] I don't know I mean I know they didn't have dentists probably back then or at least dentists as we

[00:18:04] understand them but like I mean it wasn't too hard to like count teeth I don't think but that was

[00:18:09] one of his things so anyway Aristotle was also thinking about the natural world and one theory

[00:18:15] that he came up with I think probably made a lot of sense at the time he believed that all

[00:18:21] matter was made up of four elements earth air fire and water god he sounds like a proto avatar but

[00:18:29] also he sounds like you could probably end up rings have a little captain planet situation well

[00:18:33] that's what I was going to say except I think captain planet added a fifth element that was like

[00:18:38] love it was it was hard being handicapped or something it was hard so in Aristotle's belief these

[00:18:45] four elements each had their own unique properties and characteristics and all physical objects

[00:18:50] were made up of varying combinations of these four elements this was all sort of a refined

[00:18:56] version of his mentor Plato's belief that the physical world was a manifestation of an underlying

[00:19:02] world of forms or ideas and then all objects in the physical world were made up of a combination of

[00:19:09] these forms which I feel like if you were a peasant who caught wind of that idea it would be like

[00:19:16] going to see the matrix on opening weekend and then going back into town and being like you guys

[00:19:21] are going to believe this shit is you got to hear this is crazy nuts that you mentioned the matrix

[00:19:26] opening weekend because I saw the matrix opening weekend with my dad because I believe there was a

[00:19:31] re-release in theaters because it's pre streaming people there was a re-release in theaters of

[00:19:36] empire strikes back or something and we wanted to go see it in the you had to go to the fucking

[00:19:42] movie theater and it was sold out so I was like shit and I had seen a trailer I was heard about

[00:19:47] the matrix coming out and I was like oh this movie might be cool let me went to see it and when

[00:19:52] I left the theater it was exactly what you just said I was like you people won't believe like

[00:19:57] what the fuck I just saw yeah in my dad I think he's I don't know what his reaction really was but

[00:20:02] for me I was floored by that fucking movie dude yeah yeah well I think that's exactly if you had

[00:20:09] gone to hear Plato speak in 400 BC or whatever and he was like hey simulation theory to the world

[00:20:17] there's just an underlying world of capital F forms and capital I ideas and it all manifests

[00:20:24] from that don't listen to smashing pumpkins it's not just a vampire that's a joke for no one uh

[00:20:29] I actually found a translated section of Aristotle's writings on this subject of the four elements

[00:20:35] and linked to it in the show notes it's all golly gook and gibberish like I couldn't

[00:20:39] you should have had it translated into wingedings well it's you need I feel like you need a scholar

[00:20:44] to help make sense of it I mean it's in English but it's very dense and kind of hard to follow

[00:20:49] but I do think it's worth taking a look at and reading and being struck by the realization that

[00:20:53] this was something that was thought about and written down over two thousand years ago

[00:20:59] and it feels so modern reading it even though it's hard to understand it feels like a conversation

[00:21:06] you'd have with like a stone guy in college or something also his undeniable risk comes through

[00:21:13] with why it feels so modern whoo yeah man Aristotle it's like I read a couple pages of this thing

[00:21:18] and I think I'm in love I don't know he's he's pulling me in but basically the four elements

[00:21:24] the theorized all had different properties that would combine to form the different objects in

[00:21:29] the world around us so earth was considered to be the heaviest and most dense of the elements

[00:21:35] and was associated with qualities such as solidity stability and dryness air was considered to

[00:21:41] be lighter than earth and was associated with qualities such as movement, lightness, and wetness

[00:21:47] no surprise fire was considered to be the lightest and most active of the elements and was associated

[00:21:54] with qualities such as heat, brightness, and dryness and water was considered to be an intermediate

[00:22:01] between earth and air was associated with qualities such as you'll never guess fluidity coldness

[00:22:08] and also wetness be weird if it was dryness we already got two drynesses only one wetness

[00:22:12] we got two wetnesses and two drynesses we got two well but and I think that's part of the idea

[00:22:16] that like these are all sort of a drink in a yang here yeah they're intermediaries between each

[00:22:21] other so you know none of their they're all individual elements but they share these crossover

[00:22:26] things between them and this school of thought persisted into the middle ages there's a passage

[00:22:31] from a book called the skeptical chemist spelled hilariously like spelled old middle ages style

[00:22:39] published in 1661 that illustrates sort of a rough proof of Aristotle's ideas by observing

[00:22:46] a burning log so Ed hit me with the uelog sound effect here

[00:22:53] I don't know how they sound like a crackling log

[00:22:55] no yeah yeah I'll put it in I'll put it in I'll put it in if you but consider a piece of green wood

[00:23:02] burning in a chimney you will readily discern in the disbanded parts of it the four elements of

[00:23:08] which we teach it and other mixed bodies to be composed the fire discovers itself in the flame

[00:23:15] the smoke by ascending to the top of the chimney and there readily vanishing into air manifest

[00:23:22] to what element it belongs and gladly returns the water boiling and hissing at the ends of the

[00:23:28] burning wood betrays itself and the ashes by their weight their fireiness and their dryness put

[00:23:35] it passed out that they belong to the element of earth and this is where early alchemical thought

[00:23:41] came from essentially if the only difference between lead and gold was the ratio of these four

[00:23:46] elements then by changing the proportions of elements led could be transformed into gold so

[00:23:52] what aerosol invented I think is video game crafting like aerosol invented the idea of the RPG

[00:24:00] like that's all that it is you just add you know fire points to lead and then you get gold

[00:24:05] well yeah no I think what he invented was a recipe book for the dogs you know what I mean for his

[00:24:10] boys yeah cuz that's what it is right it's literally just like add a little more lead to this

[00:24:14] add a little bit more fucking wood to this you know at a certain point you let that brew for 16 days

[00:24:20] and at the end of it you get a bar of gold what do you do not there all night in your fucking

[00:24:25] man shed turning lead into gold leave me alone it's also amazing that like you can go back to

[00:24:31] the beginning of fucking known time and there's somebody selling the idea that you can get money from

[00:24:37] nothing like it doesn't matter what the situation it's like you fucking tired listen to your boss

[00:24:42] all day well you can day trade from your basement or whatever and be fucking rich yeah it's like I

[00:24:47] know at the end of the day almost always you have to put in a hard days work to fucking get paid

[00:24:52] but even then that was like I think we can figure this recipe out we're gonna be stacking bags

[00:24:57] doing pretty much nothing well we get into some of these recipes there is a hard days work

[00:25:03] involved and so I get it yes so I just met like planting the idea of money from nothing yes well

[00:25:09] was also it was also about you know in some minds especially and I forget if I have this a little

[00:25:15] I do have this little bit later but it was about yes the pursuit of wealth but it was also

[00:25:20] about the pursuit of perfection it was about trying to like they considered gold to be a perfect

[00:25:27] element they considered immortality to be a perfect human so they were searching for both the

[00:25:31] wealth and the underlying perfection of the universe they wanted to kind of crack that code

[00:25:37] but they also only figured out how to crack any of it by just like throwing shit together in a pot

[00:25:43] so what happened sometime around the ninth century in what is now the area of Iraq and Iran

[00:25:50] a guy named Chabir Eben Haiyan took the ideas that Erisala came up with and finally added

[00:25:57] an experimental methodology to them now as an aside it's not entirely clear that Habir ever existed

[00:26:03] or at least existed is one man he's like Zoro who was under the mask every generation might be

[00:26:10] a new person but the idea of kind of I mean as early as the 10th century so really just like

[00:26:15] a hundred years after his books were written scholars were already debating if he was actually a guy

[00:26:22] or a school of alchemists using the name as a pseudonym but for our purposes for this episode it

[00:26:28] doesn't really matter it's just kind of interesting what matters is that the writer whoever it was

[00:26:33] of this collection of works built upon the previously developed Aristotelian theory of elements

[00:26:39] and Haiyan suggested the existence of different categories of matter including spirits which vaporize

[00:26:45] upon heating metals and stones which can be converted into powder which is important when we get

[00:26:50] to the philosopher's stone stuff and Habir's work laid the foundation for I mean not over exaggerating

[00:26:58] like all of modern chemistry basically like at least the structured classification of chemical

[00:27:04] substances like his practice and encouragement of scientific experimentation is what really started

[00:27:10] to transform alchemy from purely a superstitious practice to a proper scientific discipline.

[00:27:17] Haiyan and his alchemical practices are credited with the invention of all kinds of stuff used in

[00:27:23] modern chemistry including quote the crystallization calcination sublimation and evaporation

[00:27:29] the synthesis of acids hydrochloric nitric citric ascetic and tartaric acids and distillation.

[00:27:37] Haiyan used his knowledge to improve manufacturing processes which allowed advancements in major

[00:27:43] industries both in his day and today including glass making the development of steel the dying of

[00:27:49] cloth and the prevention of rust so this is where what I was saying earlier essentially alchemy

[00:27:55] was science before the natural and supernatural worlds were fully disentangled like honestly

[00:28:01] someday I could see you know if we ever finally disentangle some of our more borderline theoretical

[00:28:09] or supernatural you know physics theories like if we someday understand a more scientific

[00:28:15] uh I don't know what I'm trying to say here. I don't know what you're saying either but speaking

[00:28:19] of more or more in this case I do always find it like interesting or fun or whatever in

[00:28:25] Robinhood Prince of Thieves when Morgan Freeman's character has like a telescope essentially

[00:28:31] and it scares Robinhood yeah he thinks all of a sudden like the men on horses are way too

[00:28:37] fucking close to them yeah so I only bring that up because it's like he's from that part of the world

[00:28:41] right yeah he's supposed to be from like the Middle East essentially yeah yeah whoever they're fighting

[00:28:46] in the crusades it's just like oh yeah the guy who created chemistry and weird science came out

[00:28:52] of this part of the world yeah well I guess part of what's so interesting about this evolution

[00:28:55] of scientific theory is like I wonder 500 years or a thousand years from now what they'll look back on

[00:29:03] as stuff that we didn't quite fully understand and go oh yeah you know they eventually had to

[00:29:08] separate the study of whatever fucking gluons from everything else because they thought that was

[00:29:15] the same thing back then that's so crazy you know and we don't even know what those revelations will

[00:29:21] be we're not gonna get them in our lifetimes no no we won't but it's that's what's crazy about it feels

[00:29:27] like we're gonna be sitting right here with AI for a bit that'll be the big revelation yeah well as

[00:29:32] the Greek and Middle Eastern school of alchemy took off in Europe through translations of ancient

[00:29:37] texts a completely independent school of alchemical thought started to take off in China and Chinese

[00:29:43] alchemy was a little less focused on material sciences it was more medicinal in nature partially

[00:29:49] because it was heavily influenced by traditional Chinese medicine but that said I just thought an

[00:29:54] interesting fact some people might already know this I feel like this is sort of a bariturvy

[00:29:58] effect but one of the most lasting discoveries of Chinese alchemy is gunpowder yeah and it was

[00:30:04] accidentally invented by Chinese alchemists who were mixing powders to try to uncover in a

[00:30:10] lixer for eternal life which is hilarious because gunpowder is most certainly not used to

[00:30:16] extend anyone's life no it's very good at doing the opposite well you know when I've top five

[00:30:22] favorite movies of all time is October sky and guess it go to the nerds table with the

[00:30:27] cafeteria he wants to learn about rocketry and he's like I want to know about rockets and the kids

[00:30:31] like what do you want about rockets and he's like I want to know everything and then he did the first

[00:30:35] thing he says is like well they say that rocketry is potentially invented by the Chinese as early

[00:30:39] as 3000 BC and he was talking about fireworks and stuff or whatever yeah you tell me that just made

[00:30:44] me think of that moment in one of my favorite movies yeah it's just an odd or I cannot add almost

[00:30:50] an ironic thing that these people were obsessed with trying to find the elixir of life and

[00:30:56] and inventing gunpowder oops I mean whatever what do they say what's his name fucking Nobel invented

[00:31:02] dynamite which I knew before Oppenheimer but yeah yeah now he's named for a peace prize you know so yeah

[00:31:08] um so that idea of mixing powders to create elixirs brings us to another important element

[00:31:14] of alchemy that we should touch on which is the idea of the philosophers stone now I felt so stupid

[00:31:22] researching this part because I guess I always thought a philosopher's stone was almost like

[00:31:28] something Indiana Jones could find like it like a relic or like uh yeah it is poorly named you

[00:31:33] don't think of an equation or anything when you hear it yeah and so well Greek Arab Hindu Buddhist

[00:31:39] and European alchemists all refer to some version of this stone but as with everything alchemical

[00:31:47] it seems like the power of the stone and the definition of the stone was a little different

[00:31:52] depending on who you're reading or who you're asking essentially it's a mythic substance capable

[00:31:59] of turning basemetals such as mercury into gold or silver and it's also an elixir of life

[00:32:05] able to heal whatever illness you may have prolonging life for anyone who consumes a small piece of it

[00:32:11] some people say you have to dilute it and wine first and then drink it oh yeah I'm sure there are

[00:32:15] lots of ways you can get a philosopher's stone infusion and you know really the point is at

[00:32:21] the end of the day for centuries harnessing the power of the philosopher's stone was like the

[00:32:27] most sought after goal in alchemy the philosopher's stone symbolized perfection in its finest

[00:32:34] divine illumination and heavenly bliss so maybe what they were searching for was drugs actually

[00:32:41] I mean I'm sure they discovered a lot of drugs through this process that were definitely drugs

[00:32:46] that like destroyed you yeah it was like yo you're gonna get so high and it was like you're all

[00:32:51] your teeth are gonna fall out all your fucking your hair is gonna fall out they're not gonna know

[00:32:56] why drinking mercury to get stone does not a good idea yeah I bet you they definitely were

[00:33:01] finding all sorts of wacky shit the problem was replicating it was probably difficult and also

[00:33:07] again I can't imagine that the people who put you in charge of this are decent people like they're

[00:33:13] probably just super rich assholes who are like I want to live forever bringing me the bones as many

[00:33:18] poor people as you can right not the women though because we need a lot of teeth for this so so many

[00:33:23] you know we're actually gonna be losing money on this endeavor if you get lady mouths so bring me

[00:33:28] as many fucking teeth to make this stone as we can to be honest I had kind of a hard time wrapping my

[00:33:39] head around what the stone is exactly and how it's supposed to function I think because in some cases

[00:33:45] it is what I was saying it's like a stone that can be found in nature and then ground down and

[00:33:49] mixed with other elements but to other philosophers and alchemists the stone is more of an idea

[00:33:55] sometimes referenced as an aether or some sort of base reality which this I find really kooky

[00:34:03] and interesting the idea that the philosopher's stone represents a base reality that we are trying

[00:34:10] to conjure things from according to Plato the four elements earth air fire and water are derived

[00:34:17] from a common source associated with chaos and he referred to this source is primo materia which

[00:34:23] is also the name alchemists assigned to the starting ingredient for the creation of the philosopher's

[00:34:31] stone so essentially there are these two schools of thought the idea that it's a stone that can

[00:34:36] be found on ground and then this other school of thought that is much more esoteric that there

[00:34:43] is this primo materia this common source and that you need to somehow capture that and use it

[00:34:50] to create a philosopher's stone in the seventeenth century Thomas von writes the first matter of the

[00:34:57] stone is the very same with the first matter of all things I find this line really interesting

[00:35:05] I why find this whole school of thought really interesting because it kind of reminds me of

[00:35:11] string theory that there's some deep hidden base from which all things manifest and that's

[00:35:16] obviously super oversimplifying and I don't want to be one of those yeah I'm into quantum physics

[00:35:24] guys who like doesn't actually understand anything is is that a type of guy yeah do you run into

[00:35:29] those people at parties you run into those people at parties on the internet like people who are like

[00:35:34] yeah I've been doing a little reading on quantum physics quantum mechanics because most of those guys

[00:35:39] and and women there's plenty of women too they don't actually understand anything about math or

[00:35:44] physics they're just watch a lot of new age youtube videos sure you know like those people and I don't

[00:35:48] want to be one of those guys I don't really understand I only make that connection roughly I just

[00:35:54] think it's interesting that there's still a school of thought that is studied in modern life that

[00:35:59] roughly is the idea that there is this base below all things and that we still haven't quite been

[00:36:06] able to find it like humans seem to have always had this sense that there is something else just

[00:36:13] beyond the reach of our human reality and if we could just find it and understand it and define it

[00:36:18] we could achieve riches beyond belief you know mm-hmm mm-hmm

[00:36:24] I'm sorry am I just describing religion at this point that's fine I was thinking that too I guess

[00:36:29] in some way you're describing religion and hey look at some of those fucking mega churches mansions

[00:36:34] think they found it so yeah I don't know if that's interesting maybe that's not interesting

[00:36:38] and I provide chapters so people are like these are just too low-hards you don't know anything

[00:36:43] seeming like they read a book for the first time in their lives and now we're all supposed to be

[00:36:47] impressed they can just skip right by this we're gonna be getting to talking about fucking tiny

[00:36:51] people soon so we are before we get to the good stuff and talk about how to make homunculate at

[00:36:55] home there's one last archaic theory you should understand pre-formationism and we won't go too

[00:37:01] deep on this but I mention it because I think it's an interesting example of how scientific thought

[00:37:05] evolved and shaped some of these ideas so credit first goes to the master of triangles Pythagoras

[00:37:11] for coming up with a not triangle related idea called spermism or the idea that fathers contribute

[00:37:17] the essential characteristics of their offspring while mothers contribute only a material substrate

[00:37:23] as he called it what the fuck is a material substrate the place in which you can plant the seed oh okay

[00:37:29] literally a bun in the oven it's the bun in the oven theory literally a bun in the oven so women

[00:37:33] had less teeth than men and they basically were just ovens for tiny people I think all ovens

[00:37:38] need to exhaust in some way so if you have too many teeth that's you know what I mean you need a

[00:37:43] mouth that has vents so yeah so Pythagoras came up with spermism Aristotle accepted spermism

[00:37:50] and elaborated on it a little bit in his writings or wakid Europeans into the idea centuries later

[00:37:57] spermism kind of folded into this other debate that was going on about spontaneous generation

[00:38:03] and people believed at various points that frogs flies and other little creatures could generate

[00:38:08] almost spontaneously from warm places usually giant piles of horse crap and so these two ideas kind

[00:38:16] of blended together into this theory of preformation the idea that all creatures already exist

[00:38:22] at a microscopic size and just need the right environment to grow to full size sure that's what they

[00:38:29] thought and there were all kinds of wild ideas about how exactly humans were conceived developed

[00:38:34] are you familiar with the bottle city of candor from Superman no it's just like they wanted to save

[00:38:40] a city from krypton or whatever so I believe they shrunk the entire city in its inhabitants down

[00:38:46] into a bottle that like Superman I'm pretty sure has to keep at his fortresses solitude being like

[00:38:54] still working on getting you guys big again yeah well I mean like that's a real thing all city

[00:38:59] that actually we'll get to it a little bit but that also feels homunculus inspired because a lot

[00:39:04] of homunculi were grown in jars but we'll get to that in a minute there were all these wild ideas

[00:39:10] about how exactly humans were conceived and developed but preformation is kind of caught on in 1694

[00:39:18] when a Dutch telescopist and microscopic named Nicholas Hartzicker published a sketch that I'm

[00:39:25] not going to be able to pronounce SI Day D uptreek and this sketch portrayed a homunculus a tiny

[00:39:31] little person in a sperm cell I think I found a I'll link to an image of it in the show notes

[00:39:38] but that image really caught on with people they were like oh I get it I see where the little

[00:39:42] man comes from that is the worst image that's that's doing no in any favors in like furthering

[00:39:47] actual knowledge I mean I guess it helps oh but it's so important in the next steps of how to create

[00:39:53] a homunculi you couldn't pronounce that thing but I wonder if in English it translates to you won't

[00:39:58] believe what I'm seeing in here you won't believe what's in your balls a tiny little city I will say

[00:40:06] before I move on people at this point in the pre 1700s were developing different theories about

[00:40:13] consumption and human development there was a lot of debate about preformationism it wasn't readily

[00:40:18] accepted there were other scientists and stuff who like made fun of it so it was at the time it was

[00:40:24] even sort of uh I don't know if it was out there as much as like flat earth would be now but it was

[00:40:29] it was not necessarily the going the dominant thought the dominant theory yeah in general

[00:40:36] preformationism was a little bit hard to research because it had so many permutations and whatever

[00:40:42] but it's important because so many of the homunculi recipes rely on a tiny little man living in your

[00:40:49] sperm so that's why I touch on it because we are about to get to what you're all are here for

[00:40:55] homunculus recipes that you can try at home oh I think we know who that is it's got to be Mr.

[00:41:01] disclaimer at the door one second they should absolutely not try them at home and they're disgusting

[00:41:10] so to recap don't try this at home and don't listen if your screaming should about bodily fluids

[00:41:15] okay well see you later thanks for stopping by uh Chris you want to hit us with some recipes

[00:41:22] that people definitely should not try at home or really take that seriously so recipe number one

[00:41:28] the first known account of the production of the homunculus is said to be found in an undated

[00:41:33] Arabic work called the book of the cow the materials required for the creation of this homunculus

[00:41:40] include human semen a cow or you E W E yeah and animal blood the process involved artificially

[00:41:50] inseminating the cow or you and then smearing the inseminated animals genitals with the blood of

[00:41:58] another animal as well as feeding the inseminated animal exclusively on the blood of another animal

[00:42:07] you got that ed okay I mean I'm trying to I think from what I can understand is you can artificially

[00:42:13] inseminate it and then you gotta just feed one of these animals a bunch of blood and then when

[00:42:18] that blood animals when he's filled with blood then you take their blood and you fucking wipe it

[00:42:23] all over the other ones junk kind of well you gotta rub the animals genitals with yeah all right

[00:42:28] let me actually this is a little confused but what is it in courts in table spoons I don't understand

[00:42:35] so the materials required for the creation of this homunculus include human semen a cow or

[00:42:41] you and an animal blood from an entirely different animal an unspecified third animal let's just

[00:42:49] say lizards let's say lizard the process involves artificially inseminating the cow or you

[00:42:55] and then smearing the inseminated animals genitals with the blood of another animal the lizard okay

[00:43:02] as well as then feeding that cow or you exclusively on the blood of that lizard so whatever blood

[00:43:10] you have left over that you haven't rubbed on the cows junk now it's on a diet of that blood yes

[00:43:16] and so you would need more than a lizard you'd probably need I would imagine like a goat you need

[00:43:20] something bigger it's got to have if you're exclusively feeding a cow the blood of another animal

[00:43:26] and it has to be one animal it can't just be like bring me 22 lizards it has to be if from one

[00:43:31] lizard yeah no one animal yes so now the pregnant animal will eventually give birth to an unformed

[00:43:38] substance which would then be placed into a powder made of ground sunstone which in this case

[00:43:45] is a mystical phosphorescent elixir basically the philosopher's stone element of this recipe

[00:43:52] sulfur magnet green tutia which is a sulfate of iron and the sap of a white willow when the blob

[00:44:00] starts growing human skin okay the alchemist let me just say that phrase again when the blob

[00:44:07] starts growing human skin your halfway there alchemist would place it in a large glass or lead

[00:44:14] container for three days after that you decapitate its mother and then you feed the blob with human

[00:44:22] skin the blood of the decapitated mother for seven days and it will become a fully formed homunculus

[00:44:30] that's amazing that is so fucking crazy yeah and that's just one but also yeah I also love

[00:44:39] that like in the modern era of recipes online like every recipe I've ever looked up it's always

[00:44:46] like oh well I actually did I left it in for a day and a half and I replaced the blood of a lizard

[00:44:51] with just a bunch of oregano like people always yeah immediately change every aspect of a recipe

[00:44:56] and I'm looking online so I do wonder how that would work out in today's world but holy shit

[00:45:01] I want one of those like long-winded mommy blog recipes that's like more about oh it's not

[00:45:06] shit you skip at the beginning yeah yeah yeah yeah but for each of these yeah I don't care about

[00:45:12] this at all just tell me fucking how to make this yeah I don't care about how like your grandma made

[00:45:16] it and she met a homunculine the war and they dated like I don't need to know any of that

[00:45:20] just don't know how to make her homunculine there's another experiment in the book of the cow that

[00:45:26] isn't homunculine related but I do think it's really interesting it describes how to create a

[00:45:31] hybrid animal that has the body of a cow the face of a man and the talons of a bird and wings wait

[00:45:39] that's the fucking dumbest like like a captain crunch oops all berries yeah okay this exists in

[00:45:47] the world of captain crunch cannon as like we accidentally just made it with all berries because

[00:45:53] no one's on the outset being like listen Jen here's what I'm making it's the body of a cow the

[00:45:59] head of a no this is someone who was like whatever the fuck we just did is now this so let's just

[00:46:05] tell them that it's a recipe for that kill it like we have it yeah yeah also burn it with fire but it

[00:46:11] is like like like who the fuck's making that like I get a tiny man that's cool but like a fucking

[00:46:16] cow with the head of a man and the wings of a fucking griffin or some shit like that to me sounds

[00:46:22] like a freak isoid experiment it is so I couldn't find it wasn't elaborated on what the process for

[00:46:28] making this thing was so I am sure it is even stranger than the homunculus recipe but the other

[00:46:35] thing that is very funny to me is that the reason that you create this animal isn't to like have

[00:46:41] this cool animal or like train it like a homunculus or get it to do anything the idea is that you

[00:46:48] create this animal and then you burn it alive because if you suffugate yourself which in this

[00:46:56] case is to burn the creature and inhale the fumes of the creature the magical practitioner will

[00:47:01] become invisible I'm sorry I cut you off before I found out that they were just making it ingredient

[00:47:07] yes the creature is an ingredient and then you become invisible and then the book tells you

[00:47:13] being invisible cool you could probably come up with all kinds of ideas for what you could do

[00:47:18] if you're invisible that's never great the book says that the alchemist is then told to enter

[00:47:23] the houses of men to watch them eating and drinking and listen to their secret conversations

[00:47:29] you then commit those secret conversations to memory so that when you reveal what the men

[00:47:35] ate and said they attribute extraordinary powers to you and the author of the experiment tells the

[00:47:41] magician that if he is thought to have the gift of prophecy because of his extraordinary revelations

[00:47:47] he should say my creator sent me with angelic spiritualities but if he is thought to have mastery

[00:47:54] over the spirit world he is to say a demon told me this this is the most fucking insane like

[00:48:02] okay so alchemists in my mind right now already could just be con men in the sense that like yeah

[00:48:08] the golds coming give me another 20 million rubies yeah and I'll keep working on this but then

[00:48:13] now they really feel con many because it's like I can make you spies that's so crazy what

[00:48:19] hilarious is that it's such an overly complicated set of instructions not only are you creating

[00:48:24] an entirely mythical peeing just to set it on fire and breathe in the fumes so that you could

[00:48:29] become invisible the goal isn't to spy on them the goal is to spy on them to notice things you

[00:48:36] shouldn't know so that you can later humble brag about your cool powers what I'm saying is like

[00:48:42] the knock on effects of spying on them is being able to I guess subjugate power over them in some

[00:48:47] way by being like I know more than you do so you need to listen to me which again all comes back

[00:48:52] to like put a little money in this basket it's just so nuts but like also what do you think that

[00:48:57] conversation for that crazy winged cow is do you think they live just long enough to be like what

[00:49:01] the fuck am I and then they just light on fire I just the whole time I was reading this I was

[00:49:07] imagining like a Tim Robinson sketch where like a bunch of medieval guys are sitting around a table

[00:49:13] and one of them is like keeps smirking and trying to sneak in little facts or whatever that he

[00:49:19] shouldn't know about what they ate for dinner I know what you had for breakfast yeah and the other

[00:49:22] guys are just ignoring him yeah but he keeps trying to drop hints he's like desperate for them to

[00:49:28] notice they're ignoring him because he's forgotten he's invisible and so they just can't even

[00:49:32] fucking see them that's good but to go full con man of it all if you make everything so incredibly

[00:49:38] complicated no one can do it and if no one can do it they still have to rely on you in some way

[00:49:45] yes so if it is like oh why isn't this happening why is it why don't I have the thing you promised

[00:49:50] oh did the person tell you something that wasn't a secret you gotta start all over again

[00:49:54] because he might have just been telling you something it's that's already known or oh did you go at

[00:49:58] night actually you're supposed to go during the day there was a mis-translation here like if you

[00:50:02] keep it so insanely complicated you can always keep people not being able to call you a fucking liar

[00:50:08] yeah well there's some complications in this next one oh good we've already lost the audience

[00:50:13] so let's just this is for us we love this keep going recipe number two probably the most famous

[00:50:18] homunculus recipe I think because of how disgusting it is this would be on the side of like the homunculus

[00:50:24] Betty Crocker box like it's the one everyone knows this is the one everyone seems to reference

[00:50:29] it was written by a scholar named paracelsis in his book de natura re rum published in 1537

[00:50:39] in this work often cited as the first to use the term homunculus paracelsis describes his process

[00:50:46] for creating a punk you lie as follows quote that the sperm of a man be putrified by itself in a

[00:50:53] sealed curbite which apparently is some sort of a glass container for 40 days with the highest

[00:51:00] degree of purification in venter equinus pause what you may ask is venter equinus yeah what is that

[00:51:10] warm horse shit oh no oh a quietness because like equine I guess I'd be horses right so yeah so you

[00:51:16] put sperm in a glass container and let it soak in warm horse shit for 40 days or back to paracelsis

[00:51:24] here or so long until it begin to be alive move and stir which may easily be seen I do love that's

[00:51:34] very recipe of them and it's like look you put in for 25 minutes or until the internal temperatures

[00:51:38] 165 yeah you know it's like mileage may vary with whatever glass box we're using yeah after this time

[00:51:44] it will be something like a man yet transparent and without a body now after this if it be

[00:51:51] everyday wearily and prudently nourished and fed with the arcaneum of man's blood and be for

[00:51:58] the space of 40 weeks kept in constant equal heat of horse dung it will become a true and living

[00:52:05] infant having all the members of an infant which is born of a woman but it will be far less

[00:52:11] this we call homunculus or artificial man and this is afterwards to be brought up with as great

[00:52:18] care and diligence as any other infant until it come to right for years of understanding now this

[00:52:24] is one of the greatest secrets that God ever made known to mortal sinful man for this is a miracle

[00:52:30] and one of the great wonders of God and secret above all secrets which I guess I don't know why he's

[00:52:36] writing about it then and deservedly it ought to be kept amongst the secrets until the last times

[00:52:43] when nothing shall be hid but all things made manifest so you may notice ed yeah like you said

[00:52:51] previously some of these instructions are very complicated yeah and you know in the last one

[00:52:57] you had to use that mysterious glowing ingredient that was sort of akin to philosophy for stone

[00:53:03] yeah I have a suspicion that each one of these recipes are going to have when I'm calling a good

[00:53:07] luck ingredient yes where it's like a good luck getting that Nurnroot good luck getting a fucking

[00:53:12] piece of moon rock yeah well it's always one thing to keep it from you know calling them out on

[00:53:17] bullshit yeah the first time I read through this I thought like wow the combination of

[00:53:23] shit and blood and come is so powerful that you don't even need to use a philosopher's stone

[00:53:29] but then I read it again just for enjoyment the second time yeah there's this ingredient he mentions

[00:53:36] called feeding it in arcaneum of man's blood and so that's not just like regular man's blood in

[00:53:42] an arcaneum is not a measurement it's not like an arcaneum is not like thirteen eyedroppers drops

[00:53:47] no the translation would either mean the mysteries of human blood or mysterious human blood

[00:53:54] essentially the arcaneum of man's blood the mysterious elixir here is the philosopher's stone

[00:54:02] piece of this recipe that's the good luck ingredient yeah so no matter how much come and shit you

[00:54:08] save up until you can crack the secret of the arcaneum of man's blood you shit out of luck yeah

[00:54:15] maybe wait to buy that ingredient before you start any of the other steps yes a less mysterious

[00:54:22] ingredient that pops up a lot in homunculus lore is mandrake root and that takes us to recipe number

[00:54:28] three you've probably seen a mandrake root before they're vaguely human looking they sort of have

[00:54:34] like a thick middle root that kind of looks like a potato or a carrot yeah they're in Harry Potter

[00:54:39] yeah they're probably in Harry Potter and then they have like little other roots that protrude

[00:54:43] out like limbs and in medieval times it was thought that these mandrake roots could be used to

[00:54:48] produce homunculi these experiments with homunculi are theoretically a little easier to try because

[00:54:57] they don't require any mysterious ingredients but this first one does require hanging somebody so

[00:55:04] oh my god don't try this one at home don't try this one at all so this this this one's also gross

[00:55:11] if you haven't enjoyed the amount of body juices involved in this so some of you probably know that

[00:55:17] when people die their bowels are evacuated sure they piss and shit everywhere yeah we understand

[00:55:24] what you meant apparently when men were hung they would sometimes bust during their last convulsive

[00:55:31] spasms gross so it was said that wherever the hanged man's semen fell to the ground a mandrake

[00:55:40] would grow fell to the ground where they were in kilt or they just come so much it leaks out of

[00:55:46] their pants gross if the anthropomorphic root was then pulled out before dawn on a friday morning

[00:55:54] by a black dog oh no watch and nurtured with milk honey and sometimes human blood the root would

[00:56:03] subsequently develop into a homunculus which would guard and protect its owner wait did it say

[00:56:08] sometimes like for real said sometimes like paging their bets so it did say sometimes I don't know

[00:56:14] if this bit that I found is the actual translation of a work or if it's somebody like summarizing

[00:56:23] the work sure sure sure sure yeah but it does seem to be a through line though that it is like

[00:56:27] they always throw in something where it's like yeah you know yeah and honestly in this one the

[00:56:31] human blood is the easy part Jesus yeah first you got to hang someone who busts into the ground

[00:56:37] and then make sure that a black dog pulls it out before dawn on a friday morning and not just eating

[00:56:43] it yeah so good luck with that and now you're just like two idiots trying to get the keys from

[00:56:49] that dog and pirates of the Caribbean where you're just like come on come on come on fight oh just

[00:56:53] give me that fucking mandrake root like before it eats it it's like trying to train a pig to find

[00:56:58] truffles truffle except you have to trade a dog to find a fucking comder some guys spooge underground

[00:57:06] and here's the thing is you're getting a lot of non-hanged guys come at that point you're just

[00:57:10] the dog just bringing you calm that is like I have one job at thing how much is just on the ground

[00:57:15] I guess it's medieval times so maybe there's a lot of it out there this episode is gonna be

[00:57:22] just everyone's least favorite episode but it's also going to be someone's favorite episode though

[00:57:30] I'm I'm I'm hedging my bet on that which one are you freaks is loving this yeah we're gonna get

[00:57:36] the most letters asking us to stop the show on this episode but we also might get the most like

[00:57:42] emphatic this episode is their philosopher's stone yeah but anyway we got a lot more shit coming

[00:57:47] up I'm sure so please don't let me stop you okay so to recap if this anthropomorphic root was then

[00:57:58] pulled out before dawn on a Friday morning by a black dog then washed and nurtured with milk

[00:58:05] honey and sometimes human blood the root would subsequently develop into a homunculus which would

[00:58:11] guard and protect its owner these little creatures were also called mandragora there was I guess

[00:58:18] a whole kind of like category of these creatures in different cultures this is the flavor of

[00:58:24] homuncula you can get as the mandragoria like this is yeah it's like you would see this from

[00:58:29] your monk you listen go oh you made them with mandra yes like I can tell right away that's

[00:58:34] that flavor of her monkey life yes and French author Jean Baptiste Péta

[00:58:39] compares the creation of a mandragora to that of a homunculus he actually figured out a way

[00:58:46] to create one of these without hanging someone and tickling their taint at the same time

[00:58:50] oh gross he wrote would you like to make a mandragora as powerful as the homunculus so praised by

[00:58:58] Paracelsus then find a root of the plant called Brienne take it out of the ground on a Monday in

[00:59:05] parentheses the day of the moon a little time after the Vernal Equinox cut off the ends of the

[00:59:12] root and bury it at night in some country churchyard in a dead man's grave for 30 days water it

[00:59:20] with cow's milk in which three bats have been drowned when the 31st day arrives take out the

[00:59:27] root in the middle of the night and dry it in an oven heated with the branches of verbina then

[00:59:33] wrap it in a piece of a dead man's winding sheet which is like a burial shroud and carry it with

[00:59:38] you everywhere so for my money that's the easiest one that might be the easiest one yeah you

[00:59:44] don't have to kill anybody you have to drown three bats in cow's milk which sounds pretty awful

[00:59:50] but compared to there's no human blood involved you have to bury it in a dead man's grave but ed

[00:59:56] you're right the con is strong with this one because there's a lot of hedging this one that's

[01:00:01] very snake oil salesman it's very like he's going to sell you on like a monorail or you know

[01:00:07] it's very music manny yeah well it's a little time after the Vernal Equinox in some country church

[01:00:13] yards so it's very like yeah there's lots of little ways out of like oh you waited too long or you

[01:00:18] picked the wrong church yard yeah and I will say that this guy his version is very similar to like

[01:00:24] every Google search I do for something I'm interested in or want like to physically own

[01:00:29] I always start with like the best gaming computer the best whatever and in a medially discover that

[01:00:35] it's all out of my price range and my next Google search is always like the budget version of that

[01:00:41] and yeah and so this does feel like the budget her monkey lie where he was like you can't get

[01:00:45] nerdy root don't know no one with blood come on down to my fucking plays it'll cut the cans he

[01:00:51] also at least in this quote never promises that this thing will actually come to life he starts by

[01:00:57] asking would you like to make a mandragora and ends with rapid in the dead man's burial shroud and

[01:01:04] carry it with you everywhere and walk around for a while yeah there is no clear like what the fuck

[01:01:09] right like are you missing another page should this newspaper had yeah but he maybe just got a

[01:01:14] bunch of people to walk around with their uh mandrake roots out as little pals walking around

[01:01:21] town with them and never coming to life did you ever have to do that in school did you

[01:01:25] have to like take an egg home or like take a baby doll home no I don't think my school had that

[01:01:31] program but I know yes I know a lot of people have had to do that yeah I had to do shit like that

[01:01:35] yeah they should make it mandrake they should make mandragora you have to take a mandragora home

[01:01:40] I would be amazing if I like went to school tomorrow I highly doubt my I went to like Catholic

[01:01:44] school and shit I highly doubt they would have anything like this but it would be amazing if I

[01:01:48] went back to school and it was like oh you guys still carrying baby dolls around it was like no

[01:01:51] no we're strictly on a mandragoria curriculum now like we don't yeah yeah you don't take into

[01:01:56] consideration traditional human birth here at you know this magnet school or whatever yeah there's

[01:02:03] no sex ad here this is a homunculi only school yeah made four and buy her monkey lie homunculi first

[01:02:09] also the school is very small another almost doable recipe again I stress almost was invented during

[01:02:18] the 1700s by no less a figure of learning than Dr David Christianis from Germany's Geese in

[01:02:26] the university and according to his claim an egg should be taken from a black hen and a tiny hole

[01:02:34] should be poked through its shell okay doable so far so good yep a bean-sized portion of the

[01:02:40] albumin which I think is just a fancy term for egg white then needs to be removed and replaced by

[01:02:47] human semen sure okay okay after which the eggs opening should be sealed no problem with the

[01:02:54] hymen from a virgin maiden nope so right there got more difficult right there got more difficult

[01:03:00] that's a difficult ingredient if you have one of those laying around you're already a criminal yeah

[01:03:04] like I have so many questions and if you haven't already ground it down for another ridiculous

[01:03:11] ingredient and I don't know why are you keeping intact hymen when everyone knows they should be

[01:03:16] dried in the sun for 31 days and ground down yeah yeah yeah yeah to a crack tag thrown into a well

[01:03:22] yeah pulled back up mixed with celery anyway what comes out of that well as a galucka go the

[01:03:29] the subject of the hulu documentary galucka go on who live for our long time listeners

[01:03:35] anyway once you had your egg wrapped in a virgin's hymen it must be buried in dung during the first

[01:03:42] day of the march lunar cycle after 30 days a homunculus should emerge from the egg and as long

[01:03:48] as its owner provides it with a regular diet of earthworms and lavender seeds it will protect the

[01:03:54] owner and assist him in all of his endeavors so again almost so close to being a homunculus

[01:04:01] experiment you could try it home but you cannot so those five experiments lead us into what is

[01:04:09] the use of a humunculus well that last one had a use it was like that one's gonna take care of you

[01:04:13] what's that yeah it's gonna be your little you're instead of going to an old folks home you just

[01:04:17] have an eternal homunculi take care of you in your old age I highly doubt you'd have to have them

[01:04:21] stand each other's shoulders they're very small yeah or speaking of shoulders and small people

[01:04:26] maybe her monkey lie are the like little angel and devil on your shoulder give him little costumes

[01:04:32] oh there are costumes homunculi coming up it i'm very excited okay good uh so let's say

[01:04:36] you've gathered your horse shit and cow corpses and buckets of sperm or whatever else you need

[01:04:41] you filled them to the brim with seeds and the next thing you know you're the proud parent of a tiny

[01:04:47] little man or woman what the fuck is this thing even good for well if you're if you're mean nothing

[01:04:54] you probably just kill it immediately I don't want that in my life I don't need a forage tall

[01:04:59] little demon person running around that's the kind of language that we her monkey lie advocates have

[01:05:04] been fighting against for years they are not all demons they probably have tiny souls assuming you're

[01:05:10] not me and you are in fact charmed by this monstrosity upon god there are actually a lot of uses for a

[01:05:16] homunculi no one really quite agreed on what they were good for so you're gonna get different answers

[01:05:21] in general the homunculus was seen as a powerful but somewhat limited creation because according to

[01:05:27] a lot of homunculi lore they could only thrive within the glass vessel in which they were grown

[01:05:33] and they needed to be fed a specific type of blood that only alchemists could obtain I assume

[01:05:39] that arcane of man that we were talking about earlier sure was kind of the special blood food

[01:05:45] and if removed from their glass vessel the homunculus would only live for a short period of time so

[01:05:51] since they couldn't really go anywhere they were commonly thought of as tiny slaves basically

[01:05:57] to assist the alchemists in their experiments and then straight back to the jar straight back to

[01:06:02] the jar because we've built in a terrible shelf life for you of like 22 minutes so

[01:06:08] hand me that eraser and then get back in there you little tiny person you yes according to

[01:06:13] daily grail dot com which I'm sure is a super reliable website the 16th century English mathematician

[01:06:22] astronomer astrologer occult philosopher and alchemist dr john d tried to get in a little board

[01:06:29] identity action with his homunculi it was claimed that he used his little people as spies sending out

[01:06:36] a private army of little humanoids out into the shadows of london all died before they got to their

[01:06:42] mark yes well so he wanted them to eavesdrop on suspected enemies of queen Elizabeth the first

[01:06:49] and report back to him now as you just mentioned this would contradict the widely held belief

[01:06:54] that homunculi cannot survive for very long outside of their jar or vessel so this story warning

[01:07:01] might be bullshit or john d created a race of uber homunculi in which case we're very lucky that his

[01:07:09] instructions seem to be lost to time or he just decided at a certain point tractors are more my vibe

[01:07:15] created the very successful john deer industry that we know and no no ed this is john d not

[01:07:21] john deer what thought he was trying to be he wanted to maybe keep his last name till he had a really

[01:07:26] great creation there you go so he's like calling their monkey lie by john d then when he writes the

[01:07:30] great american novel that is the john deer then he throws his whole name on there okay I could see it

[01:07:36] I could see it other homunculi had magical powers and this is where things start to get really

[01:07:42] interesting and or stupid depending on your perspective on some of these magical abilities one

[01:07:49] of the magical abilities sometimes attributed to homunculi included something like being able to

[01:07:54] control the moon and it was said that these moon controlling homunculi can make a full moon a

[01:08:00] peer on the last day of the month which I guess before TV was a pretty cool thing to do seems like

[01:08:09] a really boring and pointless power to have but I don't know your comics guy I don't know what that

[01:08:15] would do other than I've built her monkey lie but I also have a pretty decent army of werewolves

[01:08:20] I need to do shit at the end of the month to collect rents I guess like werewolves who work for

[01:08:25] landlords okay to like muscle people into paying their rent I guess that's the use but it also

[01:08:31] feels a little bit like just another skill that is helpful for someone who's saying I'm a profit

[01:08:37] hmm where if it's like hey if I can get this guy to make the full moon outside of its lunar cycle

[01:08:42] then I can say I bet you a million dollars that there will be a full moon at the end of the month

[01:08:48] and then everyone's like that's not possible you're a lunatic and then when it happens it's like oh my

[01:08:52] god no you're no shodamas no you're a lunar tick oh shit pretty good pretty good and we're done

[01:08:58] sorry some of the other magical abilities that homuncul I had they could allow a person to walk

[01:09:05] on water or shape shift into creatures like a cow sheep or a large ape the homunculus could also

[01:09:12] grant its creator the ability to know things that are occurring far away so I guess like psychic

[01:09:17] powers they could also see and communicate with spirits and demons some could summon rain during

[01:09:24] non rainy seasons and others could produce extremely poisonous snakes a fully grown homunculus

[01:09:31] which would be the size of a very very tiny adult human was also rumored to be a skillful artist

[01:09:37] who is able to create dwarves giants and quote other marvels so basically that's the original

[01:09:42] like artificial general intelligence or whatever the other one that I either were all afraid of is

[01:09:47] the AI makes its own AI yes so if I got a homunculi you can turn out more homunculi that's kind of

[01:09:54] best case scenario yeah I mean really it seems like homunculi just kind of have this very bizarre

[01:09:59] smattering of wild powers and I almost wonder if some of this was like almost reverse engineered

[01:10:06] where someone would claim to have some kind of power and then when someone questioned them about

[01:10:10] how they would have that power they were just like oh the homunculi gave it to me sure you know

[01:10:14] because none of these are connected yeah and no one questions it everyone just leaves being like could

[01:10:19] you believe Dave as a homunculi you have fucking asshole I know like I've been trying to get a

[01:10:23] homunculi for years I just I can't like bone dry I can't come enough I have fucked every cow in this

[01:10:30] town and all I've gotten is a bad reputation and not one homunculi I've been arrested 40 times

[01:10:39] so the big outstanding question here of course is whether or not anyone ever managed on record to

[01:10:46] successfully cultivate a homunculi and the answer is not really there I looked far and wide I did find

[01:10:55] one Russian YouTube channel I will link in the show notes of a guy who was done at this point now

[01:11:01] 16 or 17 different homunculi experiments and the first ones pretty weird and bizarre but the more

[01:11:09] of them you watch the more it's clear that it's fake like they start to look really bad the more

[01:11:15] complex they get sure but I looked far and wide not a lot of proof there are a few mentions

[01:11:21] throughout history there was supposedly an extraordinary specimen exhibited in the court of

[01:11:26] France's King Louis the fourth team XIV so King Louis the 14th yeah King Louis the 14th his royal

[01:11:35] physician Dr. Borrell created this one and all I could really find about it was that it was

[01:11:40] grown from distilled human blood and it was able to emit beams of red light so there's another useless

[01:11:47] power oh my god hey did you get it did you make us one of the good ones I made us I don't know

[01:11:53] I don't know it doesn't do much I'm sorry it blink that's a party trick yeah yeah me

[01:12:00] well the homunculi is just in extreme pain every time it blinks it opens its mouth and eyes

[01:12:06] yeah they don't care they've made a little cyclops from X-Men Cyclops not Cyclops or really just

[01:12:11] the butter robot from Rick and Morty what do I do what's my purpose you shoot red light oh no

[01:12:16] it would be cool to put on a red light homunculi at like a dance party though I feel like it would

[01:12:21] be like a disco ball in the 1600s oh my god party time uh the best documentation we have for

[01:12:28] the existence of a homunculi comes from Dr. Emil Bazzetti's book Sphinx published in 1873 now I

[01:12:37] feel like at this point in human history some of these people should know better like I feel like

[01:12:43] the skeptical part of me feels like this guy was bullshitting this it's the 1870s like the civil

[01:12:50] war happened it's easy someone being like you know we would we want to want if we if my

[01:12:54] harmonculi reinforcements were finished yeah well he what the fuck you talking about her

[01:12:58] monculi when like Harvard exists and shit so he writes that two Austrian alchemists in the late

[01:13:04] 16th century count Johann Ferdinand von Kufstein and Abby Galoni created 10 living homunculi in only

[01:13:14] five weeks like many homunculi they were grown in sealed jars filled with water and eventually

[01:13:21] buried under heaps of manure they were treated with some special but again unspecified solutions

[01:13:28] so probably arcane of blood or philosopher's stone and it doubled the size of eight of these

[01:13:34] homunculi producing a series of one-foot tall specimens no two homunculi looked the same and

[01:13:41] each had its own identity so eight were physical mannequins known respectively as the king the queen

[01:13:48] the night the monk the nun the seraph the minor the architect I love it I love what I'm hearing

[01:13:55] I want to own the whole set I want like a harmonculi toy set from this yeah dude and close pertinent

[01:14:01] to their identities were manufactured for them so they had their little costumes oh my god

[01:14:07] each of these eight homunculi was fed with special pink tablets every three to four days and their

[01:14:11] water was changed once a week on at least one occasion it's written the king homunculus escaped

[01:14:18] from his jar and was earnestly trying to remove the seal on the jar housing the queen when he was

[01:14:25] spotted by count kufstein's butler he was then chased by kufstein and the butler and the king soon

[01:14:31] fainted from exposure to air and was put back inside his receptacle sure which is hilarious that

[01:14:37] this king was so horned up he was so horny he escaped it was like pounding on the queen jar I hope

[01:14:44] it's a discussion they had prior I don't hope he's not just like a fucking deviant abuser yeah

[01:14:50] but I hope they had like some sort of system of communication between jars where she's like meet me

[01:14:54] at midnight knock three times yeah and I want to say someone who's seen brighter Frankenstein more

[01:14:59] recently than I have can probably speak to this but I think this is the bit that's literally used

[01:15:04] in bright of Frankenstein like I'm pretty sure I don't know if it's called a king in the movie

[01:15:10] but I'm pretty sure one of them escapes and is like trying to mate with the other and that's part

[01:15:15] of which drives the whole like Frankenstein's monster needs a bride conversation in the movie

[01:15:21] I can't quite remember but they may have stolen the bit from count kufstein well Frankenstein's

[01:15:26] from the early 1800s I think and this is from the late 1800s yes but I'm saying bright a

[01:15:31] Frankenstein the movie from the 1930s uh oh yeah the remaining two homunculi were non corporeal and

[01:15:38] only appeared when Galoni tapped on their jars enchanted certain magical words at which point

[01:15:44] a face would materialize in the jars in one jar the liquid would turn blue in the face appeared

[01:15:50] and in the other jar the liquid would turn red the red spirit homunculus was fed on blood and

[01:15:56] its water was changed every two to three days but the blue spirit homunculus was never fed

[01:16:02] and its water was never changed which seems like a punishment oh no I also kind of imagined the

[01:16:07] blue one like that big face and power rangers oh yeah zord zord who gave them all the missions

[01:16:12] I feel like they created a sword I think he they never changed his water right the power

[01:16:18] rangers were super irresponsible homunculi owners actually wait are the putty patrol from power

[01:16:24] rangers they're kind of homunculi that's definitely fucking homunculi what a million percent and all

[01:16:30] you gotta do is punch him in the chest and they disappear so that's like I don't know there's

[01:16:33] they're so disposable yeah these little fucking they're definitely they're definitely homunculi

[01:16:39] they're just tall homunculi yeah no they definitely because I've I didn't really include it because

[01:16:43] like I said I was trying to keep it to pure homunculi but um golems in like Jewish folklore are

[01:16:49] considered like an offshoot no no I've been thinking golem this whole time yeah they kind of

[01:16:53] activate that seemed very golem to me yeah it's sort of an offshoot of the same mythology anyway

[01:16:59] so there were 10 homunculi all of them were psychic and could answer questions concerning future events

[01:17:05] they always predicted the correct outcomes of course what kind of homunculi would you be if

[01:17:11] you couldn't predict the outcomes of events you would just be that one shitty fucking one that

[01:17:16] shoots red beans yeah no man I never get anything right yeah they were also apparently and this is

[01:17:21] part of what makes this particular thing interesting unless it is all just made up apparently they

[01:17:26] were observed by lots of people including notably now I don't know who these counts were but two counts

[01:17:33] count Franz Joseph von Thun and count Max Lamberg yeah both apparently observed these homunculi now

[01:17:43] there's two things about this case one I find very funny the site that I found most of this information

[01:17:50] on self definition dot org theorizes that these homunculi may in fact have been African clawed frogs

[01:17:59] brought back by travelers from the tropics now as the resident frog expert on this podcast I can tell

[01:18:06] you African clawed frogs don't really look anything like people but what's hilarious to me is that

[01:18:13] they made costumes for these things well that's why they looked like people I know imagine if they

[01:18:17] dress the frogs like people imagine 10 jars with 10 African clawed frogs and one of them's dressed

[01:18:24] like a queen one of them's dressed like a minor I'm going to be on my deathbed thinking about an

[01:18:30] African clawed frog dressed like a knight I mean frogs you've got to kiss a lot of them to meet a

[01:18:37] prince I mean they've been somewhere within the royal spectrum of storytelling for a long time so

[01:18:42] I'm not surprised our dress and I'm like it we should try to make that the episode art an African

[01:18:47] clawed frog dressed like a knight I still have PTSD from your fucking frogs from last two weeks

[01:18:52] so you know I'd say the audience refuse to do any more frog material the audience has yes there

[01:18:58] is a contingent of the audience who seems to be very pro frog on the show but I make the final decision

[01:19:04] on what gets released that's true which is why this episode will never air the second thing I find

[01:19:11] interesting about this case is that no one knows what happened to the homunculi but there is a clue

[01:19:19] that we might sort of be able to find one of them so it's some point five this is episode

[01:19:25] become a fucking scavenger on no I wish listen everyone we have a Google map link we're sending

[01:19:30] we found an incredibly small Stuart little size graveyard we're thinking that's where it is

[01:19:38] I mean sort of at some point the jar containing the monk homunculus say that 10 times fast

[01:19:44] was accidentally dropped it smashed the pieces on the ground and the homunculus was killed

[01:19:49] and according to the writing in sphinx the homunculus's body was then buried somewhere on the grounds

[01:19:56] of coosene's tyrolean residents the problem is no one knows where the residence was but theoretically if

[01:20:04] someone could figure out where this guy lived it did could be undertaken and we might be able to

[01:20:09] find a homunculus corpse although at this point however many hundreds of years on I feel like

[01:20:15] our poor little homunculi monk is probably returned to the earth by now did you watch there was

[01:20:21] a documentary a couple years ago about like these people trying to find the place where they dumped

[01:20:27] all those it's Atari games oh yeah yeah I watch that yeah I can't I'd watch a documentary of like

[01:20:33] the oak island of looking for homunculi remains I'd watch that well dude the oak island producers are

[01:20:38] the same ones who produce secrets of skinwacker ranch yeah so if we can get one where it's like

[01:20:43] the hunt for homunculi I'd watch the shit out of that yeah let's put it this way if there's one

[01:20:47] thing that production company knows how to do it stretches show about digging for something over

[01:20:54] multiple seasons well the first season of a skin walker ranch is that there's a gentleman I'm

[01:20:59] there who like is adamant that they can't dig no I know that's one great way to like when the

[01:21:04] producers found out about that they probably were doing back flips are like oh my god

[01:21:08] we don't even need to start digging until the second season because this guy won't even let us

[01:21:13] dig for the first season dragon baby yeah so and that's all I've got on homunculi where would you

[01:21:22] place these little bastards on the fear tier this is the weirdest episode we've done and it probably won't

[01:21:28] be how many of them go but I place anyone who tried to make her homunculi fucking super high in the

[01:21:36] fear tier because they are insane broken people with a god complex because there's not a single

[01:21:43] part like there's never an ingredient in there where it's like I did that without creating real chaos

[01:21:51] but the actual homunculi themselves I mean as long as I can outrun them which I can because me walking

[01:21:57] would be like creating so much more distance than their antifull sprint but they're psychic

[01:22:03] they can talk to you through telepathy I can see and they know everything I can kind of see them

[01:22:09] causing real trouble where it's like even from the confines of their jar just like putting into your

[01:22:16] mind like weird future shit and like making use doubt things and moving the moon yeah like I can see

[01:22:23] them using their their powers for bad like they're just gaslighting everyone and yeah I also feel

[01:22:30] like I don't know I jump when I see a spider and that's small so the idea of me just in bed in like

[01:22:36] a little person like just coming over my foot like getting to the top of a mountain I don't even

[01:22:42] know I'd be so scared and like weirdly freaked out and then they like talk to me through like

[01:22:47] my mind they say you eat eight spiders a night in your sleep or something so how many homunculi are

[01:22:53] you swallowing well as you know I kind of famously couldn't swallow pills for a long time so I

[01:22:57] am pretty sure I'm gagging immediately on the first homunculi that enters my mouth so I'm not

[01:23:03] worried about swallowing homunculi okay which I'm sure at a certain point is in a recipe it's like

[01:23:08] you got a swallow nine homunculi yeah fucking create an army of them eat them all shit them out put

[01:23:13] this shit into a cow I will say I mean the only thing that might place this high on the fear tier

[01:23:18] is we all know what the top of the fear tier is it is Ed's hot bucket of shit which is a

[01:23:24] definitely an ingredient which is definitely ingredient in creating homunculi so in that sense it's

[01:23:30] probably you know it might be near the top I don't think in reality and in practice but I like

[01:23:36] where you're going with this which is it's born of the greatest fear so so by the transitive property

[01:23:42] of fear it needs to yeah then technically this is the prince of fear it is but it's also the least

[01:23:49] likely fear to affect my life so I'm putting this one very low I would say homunculi is the

[01:23:54] very bottom of my personal fear tier so far but that's okay something's gotta be at the bottom

[01:24:00] and next week we'll be back with something that ranks much higher on my personal fear tier

[01:24:05] until then you know where to find us same scared time same scared station I'm Chris Calary

[01:24:11] and I'm Edvacola and someday we'll come up with a better sign off bye bye

[01:24:15] bye

[01:24:16] scared all the time it's co-produced and written by Chris Calary and Edvacola edited by Edvacola

[01:24:21] additional support and keeper of sanity test-fifle our theme is the track scared by perpetual stew

[01:24:28] and mr. disclaimer is no part of this show can be reproduced anywhere without permission

[01:24:33] copyright astonishing legends productions night we are in this together together